ol roy lamb and rice???

ol roy started putting red dye in their normal bags of dog food, but i noticed tehy didnt put it in their lamb and rice formula of dog food. has anybody feed this to rats and mice?? if so do they like it? any sideeffects? any other information on feeding ol roy lamb and rice would be appreciated.

thanks

I'll check with a buddy of mine. I'm pretty sure that is what he uses to feed his mice. We ocassionally swap to get new blood in out lines and all of the ones I have received from him were healthy.

I feed PETsMART's brand (Authority) to my mice and rats. It's a high quality dog food at a low price. Ol Roy is not a high quality dog food...

Personally, I wouldn't feed ol roy to an ant colony much less to rodents and heaven forbid to my dogs!

Actually, I don't consider "Authority" a high quality dog food either, but that's not what this is about, afterall. (Yes, it's better than Ol Roy, but not by much)

Cheap dog food, in my opinion anyway, is not the way to raise rodents as prey items for reptiles. Red dye or not, cheap dog food is for the most part "filler". Remember the old saying "You are what you eat"? Same thing applies in this scenario. My rodents eat the best, therefore my snakes eat the best rodents. Pretty simple.

Here's another old saying...

"Cheaper isn't necessarily better"

That phrase applies to life as we know it, more often than not!

[Only my practice and opinion, take it for what it's worth, please]

So what do you use Quigs?

Eukanuba, Science Diet?

Just kidding with ya, that's some expensive dog food. I'm guess Iams?

Quigs said:

Cheap dog food, in my opinion anyway, is not the way to raise rodents as prey items for reptiles. Red dye or not, cheap dog food is for the most part "filler". Remember the old saying "You are what you eat"? Same thing applies in this scenario. My rodents eat the best, therefore my snakes eat the best rodents. Pretty simple.

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I have heard this before, and honestly wouldn't want my snakes eating dog food raised mice. Though, I have to trust that Rodentpro doesn't practice that method. What do you feed your mice Quigs?


:-offtopic I make a 50 mile trip to Petsmart just for Nutro Max dog & cat food. It IS expensive (I pay more for an 8lb bag than 20lb bags of Purina), but I see a huge difference in their coats and their droppings. It's well worth it to me.

Nutro Max?

Sounds expensive, they put steroids or something in there?

Rodent food

It's cheaper for me to get lab blocks from my local feed store. For a fifty pound bag it's $18 and made specifically for rodents. My rats and mice are nice fat, plump little morsels. :licklips: No skinny rodents and my breeders produce longer than when I fed them dog food. Check your local feed store and see if they can order you a bag if they don't already carry it. I ask them to order if for me, they get their shipments of Thursdays, so if I call on Wed. I get the food the next day.

JTGoff69 said:

I make a 50 mile trip to Petsmart just for Nutro Max dog & cat food. It IS expensive (I pay more for an 8lb bag than 20lb bags of Purina), but I see a huge difference in their coats and their droppings. It's well worth it to me.

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Nutro is a pretty good food still, as far as I know. The reason you see smaller and normal stools is because more of the product is useable food not as much filler. Better stuff in the pet food, more benficial for the animal...higher the cost. It's well worth it in my eyes.

Purina is filled with sawdust more or less, hence they eat more of it, poop more and generally a looser stool. Look at dog foods next time you are out. On many the first ingredient is corn. First of all dogs are carnivorous creatures (for the most part anyway). Secondly corn is a filler, and we all know about how well corn is digested. This also lends a theory to why some dogs eat their own stools. The first question a vet would ask in this situation is what kind of food do you feed? Chances are (if in fact it's a low grade food) that they find it appealing because there is undigested food still within. Gross I know, but that's how it's been explained to me.

I feed all the mice here lab blocks formulated specifically for rodents. I personally use Mazuri Rodent 6F 5M30. That is the staple diet they produce. They make several other forumulas including a "breeder" diet. I have excellent sucess with the basic diet though. A 50 pound bag runs between $22 - $25 around here and last me usually 2 - 3 months feeding close to 100 adults.

Although, I buy it from a feed mill and alot of times they have broken bags around that they either just give me or charge a very minimal price, depends on who is working that day. lol

The colleges and labs around here under no circumstances will take open/broken bags of lab blocks. They are also very picky about experation dates. Most won't take food not only that is expired but they don't want it if it's within 60 to 90 days of experation either.

My mice aren't that picky...lol Truth be known the food has a shelf life of a year after the printed experation date as long as it is kept cool and dry.

Joejr14 said:

So what do you use Quigs?

Eukanuba, Science Diet?

Just kidding with ya, that's some expensive dog food. I'm guess Iams?

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Our dogs get a premium food called 'Sensible Choice'. It's made locally, while it's not on shelfs all across the country, it is pretty readily available if you check around and ask for it. A few years back, I was planning on moving to Washington state and it was available there.

Yes, it's fairly expensive. Especially feeding 3 dogs between 70 - 100 pounds!

I wouldn't have it any other way though. Two of our mutts have been on it for over 10 years and they are worth every penny to me!

We give the mice a handful of it about once every month or two. But protein and fat is considerably higher and the fiber content is lower than that of lab blocks.

In short...

Feed dogs, dog food. Feed rodents, rodent food. Afterall, they have different nutritional needs!

Joejr14 said:

Nutro Max?

Sounds expensive, they put steroids or something in there?

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Actually, it's Nutro Natural not Max, my bad. It's lamb, rice, some vegetable protein, and lots of vitamins. It's great for their coats, more shine and an overall better look. And as Quigs points out, less filler, so in turn less and more compacted stools. (Always a plus!) I pay $8.99 for 8lbs.

I'm wondering if anybody knows which rodent suppliers use lab blocks for feed and which are known to use dog food?

Rodent suppliers feed

I think the rodent suppliers that feed the lab blocks formulated for rodents will say so on their web sites. I remember reading it here and there, don't remember which ones specifically. :shrugs: Check around and read what they say.

Silvia

If you compare Authority to Nutro...They are very similiar. Eukanuba on the other hand, is not a high quality dog food. If you look at the first ingredient listed on any dog (or cat) food and it states Corn or Corn Meal, it is not a high quality dog food. You want a MEAT product listed first.

I wish I could find a place to purchase lab block in bulk. I have to pay $2.50 a pound at the local pet store...and that just bites.

My rodents are not strictly on dog food. They get fresh veggies and a mix of lab block and Authority every day.

blckkat said:

If you compare Authority to Nutro...They are very similiar. Eukanuba on the other hand, is not a high quality dog food. If you look at the first ingredient listed on any dog (or cat) food and it states Corn or Corn Meal, it is not a high quality dog food. You want a MEAT product listed first.

I wish I could find a place to purchase lab block in bulk. I have to pay $2.50 a pound at the local pet store...and that just bites.

My rodents are not strictly on dog food. They get fresh veggies and a mix of lab block and Authority every day.

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While not in bulk, Petsmart.com has 5lb bags of Kaytee Lab Block for 6.39. If you were to get 8 bags and add the 8.99 for ground shipping, and then divide your total by 40pounds it comes out to about $1.50 a pound.

Not great, but it saves some money.

blckkat said:

If you compare Authority to Nutro...They are very similiar. Eukanuba on the other hand, is not a high quality dog food. If you look at the first ingredient listed on any dog (or cat) food and it states Corn or Corn Meal, it is not a high quality dog food. You want a MEAT product listed first.

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My 40 lb bag of Eukanuba Large Breed formula dog food lists "chicken" as its first ingredient. I and most of my Retriever Club buddies would disagree with your assessment. (Note: When dog food ingredients are listed, "chicken" implies muscle meat; "chicken meal" is any chicken part ground with a grain, "chicken by-products" is either a) "primary by-products" which are organ meats or b) "secondary by-products", or "parts is parts", as the saying goes.....)

JTGoff69 said:

Actually, it's Nutro Natural not Max, my bad.

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Actually, it's "Nutro Natural Choice". If it's the standard Lamb & Rice formula, it's the forest green bag with the sheepdog on the label. If it's the "small bites" formula, it's a light green bag with, I think, a sheltie.

Quigs said:

Our dogs get a premium food called 'Sensible Choice'. It's made locally, while it's not on shelfs all across the country, it is pretty readily available if you check around and ask for it.

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Sensible Choice is under the umbrella of Royal Canin , the huge multinational pet food manufacturer.

So, given this info, we can draw a couple of conclusions.
1) I know wayyyy too much about dog food. Current occupational hazard.
2) Good Lord, I gotta get back into IT work. :crazy02:

Quigs said:

In short...Feed dogs, dog food. Feed rodents, rodent food.

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Wisest advice in this thread, imho.

regards,
jazz
(Your Cliff Claven of Canine Consumables)

jazzgeek said:

Actually, it's "Nutro Natural Choice". If it's the standard Lamb & Rice formula, it's the forest green bag with the sheepdog on the label. If it's the "small bites" formula, it's a light green bag with, I think, a sheltie.

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Absolutely correct Cliff! LOL It's the small bites since I have the chihuahua. I started feeding Nutro Natural when I had my 2nd Shar Pei. (A breed INFAMOUS for having skin problems) The first one I had made my house smell so bad no one wanted to come in! Of course that was in the days when most of them were completely inbred. I bought the 2nd from a wonderful breeder, (paid more for that dog than my current vehicle!) and fed him Nutro Natural Choice from day 1. He never had any skin problems, and his coat was always shiny and soft.


And I have to agree with your assesment of Quig's advice. :wavey:

jazzgeek said:

Sensible Choice is under the umbrella of Royal Canin , the huge multinational pet food manufacturer.

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That's correct, however that is a fairly recent merger. Can't remember when, been a couple years I'd bet. It used to be made by the 'Waynes' Company.

jazzgeek said:

(Note: When dog food ingredients are listed, "chicken" implies muscle meat; "chicken meal" is any chicken part ground with a grain, "chicken by-products" is either a) "primary by-products" which are organ meats or b) "secondary by-products", or "parts is parts", as the saying goes.....)

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I had forgotten to add that in my post. By-Products and anything "Meal" is a no-no. We have always fed our dogs (Dobies and Rots) Nutro. Royal Canin I would recommend for small breeds. If I move onto a smaller breed of dog like I've been thinking (Pomeranians most likely), they will be fed Royal Canin.

Joejr14, I didn't know PETsMART carried 5lb bags of Kaytee. When I had left there (I worked for them for a year), they were selling 2lb bags for $6. That was of course when they first started carrying the product. Maybe it has since gone down in price? I will check the store I had worked for and see what's going on. 40lbs of that stuff would probably last me 2 months.

for me as well knowing WAY to much about dog and cat food is an occupational hazard. I work for the pet store i hope to own soon. At any rate, i'm in total agreement that nutro is a GREAT food. Eukanuba is not a BAD food by any means, however it is not BETTER per se than nutro, and has a much higher price tag (and the stores that sell it make WAY less profit than on other brands of dog food)
Most purina products are not good, same goes for pedigree. All of them have the first ingredient corn or bi-product. If your feeding cat foods i would steer away from Friskies and meow mix as well.
Iams is not a bad food, but i take personal exception to their testing methods, and over-priced for the quality.
I personally feed my mice rat and mouse mix, with the occasional greens.

luvofthechase said:

for me as well knowing WAY to much about dog and cat food is an occupational hazard. I work for the pet store i hope to own soon. At any rate, i'm in total agreement that nutro is a GREAT food. Eukanuba is not a BAD food by any means, however it is not BETTER per se than nutro, and has a much higher price tag (and the stores that sell it make WAY less profit than on other brands of dog food)

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The profit and the price don't necessarily correlate. My margins (in terms of percentage of cost) on Nutro and Eukanuba are the same; granted, Nutro costs less than Eukanuba; but I'm making the same amount as a percentage of the cost.

As for my market, Eukanuba outsells Nutro. The number one bag of dog food I move is Eukanuba Large Breed; Nutro Natural Choice Lamb & Rice is second, and Eukanuba Large Breed Puppy is third (the highest priced of the three).

Most purina products are not good, same goes for pedigree. All of them have the first ingredient corn or bi-product. If your feeding cat foods i would steer away from Friskies and meow mix as well.

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Agreed, to a certain extent. The Pro Plan line of Purina isn't half bad; they have a new "Sensitive Skin and Stomach" formula that uses salmon as the protein source - and given the Omega 3 & 6 fatty acids in salmon, I've seen great results from my customer's dogs who have NEEDED to use it because of allergic reactions to chicken, or dry skin.

Pedigree? Dreck, no doubt. Also, I DEFY anyone to look at the "Beneful" ads and then look at their ingredient list. You'll realize you've become a victim of marketing.

Iams is not a bad food, but i take personal exception to their testing methods, and over-priced for the quality.

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You do realize that Eukanuba is the "premium" brand of IAMS, no?

I personally feed my mice rat and mouse mix, with the occasional greens.

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Ah, back on topic! No experience here, I buy f/t. :shrugs:

regards,
jazz