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In case anyone is tempted to use sand...

princess

princess

Cornaholic
http://www.pythons.com/calcium.html

-is where I found an interesting article on sand substrates.

Don't worry, I wasn't looking at it for my snakes, I'm thinking about getting some Leo's this summer and am starting to do the research/homework. I believe that anyone getting a new species should read anything possible about the animal in order to give the poor creature a good chance of survival.
 
That's a very interesting article. It really brings home the dangers of new substrates, and the dangers of feeding on substrate.
 
Please bear with me here, but I own Tarantulas and Scorpions as well as snakes. Sand is a big no no for Arachnids because it can gum up the poor creatures' mandibles by becoming encrusted to the little hairs in it's mouth almost like hardening cement. Just imagine what that stuff could do to a poor reptile's digestive tract.
 
I like the fact that the article comes not only from a hobbyist perspective, but from a scientist's perspective too. So it's not just a 'I've been keeping snakes since before you were born and I say you should do this...' The guy had conducted some experiments in a lab and presented his findings to support his hypothesis along with his observations. I can respect that.
 
that was my thought too, when i read the beginning of it i was thinking, "Great, heres another hobbyest that is just blaming his last enviroment change". but the actual scientific testing was AWESOME.
 
Thank's princess for posting it, I don't use sand and don't recomend it but now their is something which can back up people's "suspitions" of sand. Thank you very much.
 
i dont even keep my beardies on sand, they lick the ground so much, to smell their environment, that i just hate the thought of even 5-6 pebbles of sand going inside of them, its just a personal preference to keep everything on newspaper or a substrate that my lizards can digest and pass if the do get some on their sticky tongues.
 
if you want to use something that looks like sand, I hear that coral sand is perfectly ok (as long as your snake doesn't eat it by accident during feeding times!)
 
I use it because the lady I bought my snake from uses it for all her snakes (she has ALOT of snakes both in her shop and in her animal rescue center). She's been using it for years and has never had any problems so I trust it, but everyone has their own opinions :)
 
well this sucks i just got three bags of T-Rex Bone aid clci-sand for my beardie, i really wanted a safe sand type substrate, i havn't opend the bags yet but i can't find the recipte so i don't know if i can take it back or not but it has on the bag, 100% digestible , Reduced impactability, beneficial when eaten. on the back it goes on about how its the only calcuim sand designed and safe for reptiles? this brand wasn't mentiond in the artical? anybody use this or should i take it back?
 
hop on over to www.beardeddragon.org, I frequent the site. Do a search on substrate. All your beardie questions will be answered.

http://www.beardeddragon.org/bjive/viewtopic.php?t=11023&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

http://www.beardeddragon.org/bjive/viewtopic.php?p=72400

http://www.beardeddragon.org/bjive/viewtopic.php?p=72100

I also wanted to add, just because the bag SAYS it's safe, doesn't mean it is. Marketing is marketing. It's not like the FDA or whomever monitors pet products. Hot rocks are still being marketed even though they are known to create thermal burns, right???
 
blckkat said:
calci-sand/repti-sand/etc. are all the same...
Click to expand...
This is akin to saying that "Ol Roy, Nutro Natural Choice, Canidae, Eukanuba, Purina Dog Chow, etc. are all the same". Sure, they're all for the same PURPOSE, but I'd think that most dog owners would disagree.

Just by LOOKING at a bag of Calci-Sand and Repti-Sand side by side, I can see visible differences. Sure, they're both calcium carbonate-based substrates, but application and composition are two different things.

O, and the colors in the stuff...Will dye your animal...
Click to expand...
With what? Red #2? Carotinoids? Phenolphthalein? Vegetable dye? Is it something inert, or something harmful? And, for how long? Is it temporary, or permanent?

After all, "chocolate will turn your teeth brown".

This may be the case, but....YUMMMMMMM. :crazy02:

regards,
jazz
 
Before I knew better (from frequenting www.beardeddragons.org), I kept my 1st dragon on orange sand (not sure the brand). He was taken off it 5 months ago and STILL has his tails and toes orange.

Jazz, I think you should register on the BD forum and tell them your extensive experience and opinion on pet store sand. See what they say. :)
 
blckkat said:
Before I knew better (from frequenting www.beardeddragons.org), I kept my 1st dragon on orange sand (not sure the brand). He was taken off it 5 months ago and STILL has his tails and toes orange.
Click to expand...
And again, I ask.....
jazzgeek said:
With what? Red #2? Carotinoids? Phenolphthalein? Vegetable dye? Is it something inert, or something harmful? And, for how long? Is it temporary, or permanent?
Click to expand...
Yeah, I used the orange sand for all of a month, myself. Took two sheds to get rid of the coloration. Didn't kill him, either. ;)
Jazz, I think you should register on the BD forum and tell them your extensive experience and opinion on pet store sand. See what they say. :)
Click to expand...
LOL....sure, I'll do that when you register on the working retriever website and win 'em over by feeding Authority over Eukanuba. ;)

Meanwhile, since we cite the CSM here so often, I refer you to page 25 ("Substrates" section) of The Bearded Dragon Manual (de Vosjoli, Mailloux, Donoghue, Klingenberg, & Cole):
Substrates
Because of the potential risk of sand impaction, many people choose to initially raise baby bearded dragons on newspaper. For animals over 8 inches, we use silica-based, dust-free play sand (used in children's sandboxes) as a substrate and have never had problems with impaction.

< further down, it reads: >

Sand: Sand is our favorite substrate.
Click to expand...
So, I tell you what. Mention to the BD forum that Bob Mailloux (a guy who has a small business breeding beardies), with HIS "extensive experience and opinion", uses (gasp! ) "Home Depot" sand (as opposed to my "pet store" sand).

See what they say. :)

regards,
jazz
 
That's exactly what I'm saying, Jazz! "Playsand" is completely exceptable in the BD world! But not the sands with Calcium (petstore sands mostly). This is due to the fact that the animals are more likely to ingest the sand (Leos have been known to do this more so) because it has Calcium in it. They'll actually attempt to eat it!

On the dog food issue. I would never, ever feed any of my dogs (or cats for that matter) Eukanuba (nor would I purchase an animal from a breeder if their contract states they must be fed Eukanuba through their first year - which has happened). The only reason why Eukanuba is such a recommended dog food to purchase is because of their marketing...They sponsor all of the large dog shows. Doesn't mean they're a good food choice! :crazy02: Small dogs get Royal Canin, large dogs get Nutro. That's just how it's always been in my family...Only the best! May be more expensive, but it's worth it in the long run!
 
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