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Got some new goodies and I thought that someone could answer some questions for me

A

amber_marshall75

New member
Sorry I am so excited about these they were exactly what I was looking for and I finally found them. Yeah me. Let me know what you think

Pic # 1 This my new male Lavender HET Hypo yearling. Question: Is this considered a Motley?

Pic # 2 This is my new female Hypo HET Lavender yearling. Question: Is this one a Motley

Pic # 3 This is my new male Motley Coral Snow yearling, so far this is the most perfect motley I have ever laid my eyes on. What do you this about him.

Any idea what I can expect from the first 2 as a pair and what happens when you breed a regular white Motley snow to a Coral Motley snow? Will I get any pink babies?

I thank all of you for your help in my time of learning as much as I can about corns.
 

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No edit button activated or am I just overlooking it?

I was going to point out that if it is a motley it will have a clear belly with no checkering.

Do they have a checkered belly?

Rick
 
The first two do not look Motley from the dorsal view. Could you post ventral shots? I believe that their is a motley type gene that loses the belly checkers floating around some where. I have 2 female normals that do not have any black belly checkers, but do have orange markings that resemble checkers (they are possibly het Motley).
 
If the suspected motleys have no checkering its a good sign they are indeed motley. If the checkering is there, but lightly colored (such as orange) then its still checkered, just washed out.

As I stated prior, the first two do not look motley, but the third one does appear to motley.

Pictures of the bottom of the snakes would help.

Rick
 
Until they breed and throw Motley offspring of some sort, I would be hesistant to call them Motley. I've read that being Het Motley can give some funky belly pattern, but still...a completely clear belly should have the dorsal pattern of a motley, stripe, or diffused, none of which traits I see on the above snakes.

Just because they don't have full black checkers doesn't mean they don't have checkers. My amels have orange or yellow checkers, my hypo lavender has greyish checkers, my snow has yellow checkers.

If you don't have it already, I would recommend Kathy Love's book on Corn snakes and Serpwidget's book on morphs and genetics. They're both invaluable at telling you what makes a morph. It sounds like you really need a good grasp on what the morphs are before you delve into breeding them.

Looking at your signature, I have to wonder where you got your snakes from. What the heck is a "blue-eyed banded ghost"? Or an "orange albino motley" or a "white snow"? Sounds like petstore gobbledy-gook to me.


And to answer your question...

I'm guessing a White Snow is just a typical Snow corn without any other genes present. To get a snow you have an animal that is homozygous for Anerythristic and Amelansism. A Coral Snow is commonly known as a Hypo Snow, so it has the genes of Anerythristic, Amelanistic, and Hypomelanistic. So if you bred the two together you'd get all Snow's het for Hypomelanistic.
 
Coral Snows are usually Hypo Snows...

So you would produce Snow Mots het Hypo (Coral)

Taceas - It is very possible he has a Blue-Eyed Banded Ghost...Their is such a thing as a Blue-Eyed Ghost...and their is such a thing as a Banded corn...
 
I have heard of and seen a Banded corn. Never on a Ghost before, but not saying it can't be done.

I have never heard of a blue-eyed Ghost before. I've heard of a Ruby-eyed something or other, however.
 
Taceas said:
Until they breed and throw Motley offspring of some sort, I would be hesistant to call them Motley. I've read that being Het Motley can give some funky belly pattern, but still...a completely clear belly should have the dorsal pattern of a motley, stripe, or diffused, none of which traits I see on the above snakes.

Just because they don't have full black checkers doesn't mean they don't have checkers. My amels have orange or yellow checkers, my hypo lavender has greyish checkers, my snow has yellow checkers.

If you don't have it already, I would recommend Kathy Love's book on Corn snakes and Serpwidget's book on morphs and genetics. They're both invaluable at telling you what makes a morph. It sounds like you really need a good grasp on what the morphs are before you delve into breeding them.

Looking at your signature, I have to wonder where you got your snakes from. What the heck is a "blue-eyed banded ghost"? Or an "orange albino motley" or a "white snow"? Sounds like petstore gobbledy-gook to me.


And to answer your question...

I'm guessing a White Snow is just a typical Snow corn without any other genes present. To get a snow you have an animal that is homozygous for Anerythristic and Amelansism. A Coral Snow is commonly known as a Hypo Snow, so it has the genes of Anerythristic, Amelanistic, and Hypomelanistic. So if you bred the two together you'd get all Snow's het for Hypomelanistic.
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Hopkins Holesale Herps has BLUE EYED BANDED ghosts. I have a pair and there eyes are blue not gray. Go check him out at: http://hometown.aol.com/hopfam1/HopkinsHolesaleHerps.html
As far as my orange albino motley I was trying to explain what he looks like not necessarily what I bought him as and my "white snow" again I have seen several snows that have colored saddles and I was trying to explain that mine was just a plain white motley snow and didn't have any coloring what so ever on her. I am not a moron and I have Kathy's book but that doesn't mean that I don't have questions about snakes that I am getting or ones that I currently have. I was even aware that coral snows were hypo snows. Suprise, suprise! It was my understanding when I joined this forum that you could ask questions and not be treated like I am some sort of idiot. My son and I have been working with reptiles for over 10 years this is just my first year with corns. I see that some of the "Master's" come on here to ask questions are they ridiculed for trying to describe something? Not that I have seen. I don't know about you but I have some corns that defy any explanation that is in any book that I have read so far. I will be more than happy to post some pictures and you can let me know what they are. Maybe you are better at that than Kathy Love or Don Soderberg who were both unable to give me a morph/pattern name for some of them.
 
Some breeders will put fancy names on their corns in order to make it appear that they have something extra special in order to ask a higher price for them. Blue-eyed ghosts and Red Velvet hypos may be a perfect example. Some anerys and ghosts have blue eyes as well as some hypos have a rich red color. It does not necessarily make them any more valuable, genetically speaking, than most other anerys, ghosts or hypos. If these corns reproduce their "specialness" in multiple genetations, they may be considered a variation of a genetic morph and may deserve a special name if they are truly different than other specimens.
 
I am not a moron and I have Kathy's book but that doesn't mean that I don't have questions about snakes that I am getting or ones that I currently have. I was even aware that coral snows were hypo snows. Suprise, suprise! It was my understanding when I joined this forum that you could ask questions and not be treated like I am some sort of idiot. My son and I have been working with reptiles for over 10 years this is just my first year with corns. I see that some of the "Master's" come on here to ask questions are they ridiculed for trying to describe something? Not that I have seen.
Click to expand...

Did I say that you were a moron? No. I wasn't even implying it. Based on the information of your post, I was led to believe certain things. Pardon me for ever thinking otherwise. I guess the old adage about assumptions was true. So I apologize if anything I said was especially demeaning, as it wasn't meant that way. A lot of meaning can be lost in text, you can't get the tone of voice it was said in or even facial expressions. Most people around here can tell you that I don't go out of my way to make people feel like retards or unwelcome.

People are not mind readers, myself included. This is the first post I had ever read by you, believe it or not, and I don't know jack about you, what you keep, who you're married to, or your basic knowledge of cornsnake genetics. Based on the questions that you asked, it sounded extremely non-existant considering snows can be quite variable, and just because they don't have colors you generally see doesn't mean they're always something special. If you knew what Coral Snows were and what regular Snows were, it should have been common knowledge as to what breeding said corns would produce.

Coral Snow or Regular Snow?
Frost1.JPG

Regular

Coral Snow or Regular Snow?
Glacier060305.jpg

Regular

Coral Snow or Regular Snow?
Snow21.jpg

Regular

Coral Snow or Regular Snow?
Pepto061705A.jpg

Regular

Snows have ALL sorts of variations! But I'd have to venture that if yours shows not much color at all, then perhaps it isn't as you bought it as. Susan has a point, people will make up nifty names and then try to pass it off as something new and unusual. At a show earlier this year, someone was marketing "Checkerboard Corns". When a certain member of this forum went over to check it out, he thought they were something special based on the "checkering" of the belly pattern. A few years ago I'd heard some pretty interesting things from Mr. Hopkins and his sales practices in the past.

Maybe you should post some pictures of your corns that defy explanation and people can comment on what you may or may not have.

And please stop with the "Contributors get treated different because they're speshul" BS. I am sick to death of that. I am no more special than anyone else. Just because we felt like paying to help keep this site running doesn't mean diddly in the grand scheme of things. There are a lot of other people who haven't paid who have been here longer than me.

"If you go around through life and expect to be wronged, you won't be disappointed."
 
LOL...I am definitely not a big fan of breeders "slapping a name on something to get more money." I do have to mention to any of you who have not seen the blue-eyed ghosts or red velvet hypos from Jim, they do look quite different and may actually deserve their name. I personally have some of these snakes. I got most of them before they were given their new names, however.

I know many of you have seen pictures of my weird ghost and hypo. They are both from Jim Hopkins. I did some breeding trials with them this season. I will be posting those results on the forum very soon. I have more testing to do, but I tested them against hypo A, ultra, and lava.

I have a "red velvet" hatchling, a hypo A hatchling, and an ultramel here at the moment. I will try to get a comparison picture of them.
 
CornCrazy said:
LOL...I am definitely not a big fan of breeders "slapping a name on something to get more money." I do have to mention to any of you who have not seen the blue-eyed ghosts or red velvet hypos from Jim, they do look quite different and may actually deserve their name. I personally have some of these snakes. I got most of them before they were given their new names, however.

I know many of you have seen pictures of my weird ghost and hypo. They are both from Jim Hopkins. I did some breeding trials with them this season. I will be posting those results on the forum very soon. I have more testing to do, but I tested them against hypo A, ultra, and lava.

I have a "red velvet" hatchling, a hypo A hatchling, and an ultramel here at the moment. I will try to get a comparison picture of them.
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Terri,

Thank you for your support. Your right about Jim's snakes they are total unique. Finally someone who knows what I am talking about. Have you been able to breed a pair of his "Milkshake" snakes? If so what did you get out of the clutch? I only got 7 eggs out of one pair that i got from him and not one of them was the same. It was a hypo female and my orange hypo motley (whatever you want to call him) it is true what he says about his milkshake's. I held all mine back. I got one amel, one red velvet, one striped ghost w/ blue eyes, one hypo motley, one aberrant hypo (I don't know how else to describe it. His pattern was all over the place. Very strange looking snake and he is orange looks kinda like his dad) and one red one just like the last one I described but RED! and a zigzag anery. I was shocked! They were so beautiful. Let me know if you have bred yours yet.
 
Taceas said:
Did I say that you were a moron? No. I wasn't even implying it. Based on the information of your post, I was led to believe certain things. Pardon me for ever thinking otherwise. I guess the old adage about assumptions was true. So I apologize if anything I said was especially demeaning, as it wasn't meant that way. A lot of meaning can be lost in text, you can't get the tone of voice it was said in or even facial expressions. Most people around here can tell you that I don't go out of my way to make people feel like retards or unwelcome.

People are not mind readers, myself included. This is the first post I had ever read by you, believe it or not, and I don't know jack about you, what you keep, who you're married to, or your basic knowledge of cornsnake genetics. Based on the questions that you asked, it sounded extremely non-existant considering snows can be quite variable, and just because they don't have colors you generally see doesn't mean they're always something special. If you knew what Coral Snows were and what regular Snows were, it should have been common knowledge as to what breeding said corns would produce.
Click to expand...

Well I would like to apologize to sometimes I have the tendency to take things to personally when I shouldn't. You are correct in saying that I need to get the Genetics Book on corn snakes.

A little history for you: I am a single mom. When my son was little we got into red tail boa's and bred those for several years and then added in ball pythons and Burmese. Then in 2001 I got pregnant with my daughter and decided that the boas and pythons needed to go. So we sold all of our stock and got into bearded dragons and started raising those and then began breeding them. I really got into those due to there disposition and I didn't feel that they threatened the safety of my children since they are so docile in general. I became very sick and couldn't care for them anymore so we sold those off to. When I got back on my feet, my son, now 11 with an IQ of 162, who wants to be a Herpetologist, wanted to get back into snakes but I was not willing to go with the boas and pythons again so I happened upon someone from the East TX Herp Society and she recommended corn snakes. Not to big, not to small, great dispositions, etc... So my son started researching them and we bought a couple at the next reptile show that was here. Well now I am up to about 40+ corn snakes of all different morphs and patterns, adults and babies. Now my daughter, who is 3, has gotten into them also and has her own snakes that she cares for by herself after watching her brother for so long. She wanted pink, purple, and yellow so she has 1.1 butter motleys, 0.1 sunglow, 3.2 coral snows, 1.0 lavender het hypo and 0.1 hypo het lavender, and she has staked claim on my son 1.1 blood reds so I had to order another pair for her. She feeds them and cleans there tanks as needed and monthly we take out everthing and clean out there cages/tubs completely. She does most of this for her snakes all by herself I only help when needed and I make sure she washes her hands throughly after all cleaning.

So i am trying to learn everything that I can about corns so I don't screw up in breeding and get all normals cause I didn't breed the correct morphs. But you are absolutely right in saying I need to get the genetics book. I am sure that would teach me a lot.

Now if you have questions about red tails, balls, Burmese, or bearded dragons I can answer those!

FYI: I didn't have the money before to become a contributing member but I do now and I plan to shortly.

Thanks
 
Susan said:
Some breeders will put fancy names on their corns in order to make it appear that they have something extra special in order to ask a higher price for them. Blue-eyed ghosts and Red Velvet hypos may be a perfect example. Some anerys and ghosts have blue eyes as well as some hypos have a rich red color. It does not necessarily make them any more valuable, genetically speaking, than most other anerys, ghosts or hypos. If these corns reproduce their "specialness" in multiple genetations, they may be considered a variation of a genetic morph and may deserve a special name if they are truly different than other specimens.
Click to expand...
Susan,

If you checked out Jim's site his prices are not high compared to some other sites that I have seen.
 
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