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Gravid in October Needs Advice...

OkeeteeMom

OkeeteeMom

Lovin' My Snakes!
So I just purchased (what most believe to be) a gravid Okeetee. She's my first, so I'm learning as much as I can as quickly as I can. BUT, I need help and suggestions.

I live in an altitude where the days are currently around 68F and the nights are dipping down to the mid 50'sF. I currently have a blackish light on her (75w) that generates some heat.

Should I keep this light on 24/7? Should I just let her adjust to the normal temps? I want her to lay eggs for sure, but I want more for her overall health.

Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions? All would be appreciated!

PS: I have an album on her in my profile
 
No other source of heat. I was told (by the shop) that if I left that dark light on 24/7 it would be good enough. Are they wrong again?
 
Yes, they are wrong. Under tank heater. Corns are primarily nocturnal. only put the UTH on one end of the tank about 1/3 and have at least two hides, and fresh water.
 
oh, and also, about 1 to 2 weeks (7-14 days) before the female lays, she will shed; after this point, she will not eat until after she lays the eggs.

This is the optimal point at which you should prepare the lay box. You can use a bucket or plastic storage box that is large enough for the female to coil in with an access hole in the side.

Fill the container half-full (or 1-2 inches) with moist (not saturated) medium (either peat moss, sphaghum moss, or vermiculite). This will help the eggs from dehydrating as well as from getting rolled around by the female's body.

In most cases the female will lay in the lay box, but otherwise, she may lay in another shelter or under landscape.
 
GOLDELX6...

I already have a nesting box set-up, so I'm good on that.

And you suggest an under-tank heater, correct? And would I place that at the end where her cave is with her water at the other end of the tank?

Here's what's both interesting and confusing to me (mind you, since I'm so new to all this, there's a lot that's making my brain bulge!)...The shop told me that "Evie" shed in the past two weeks. Yet she wolfed down a rat hopper on Sunday and calmly ate 2 pinkies yesterday.
 
Yes...You need an undertank heater, that covers about 1/4 of the bottom of the viv, in one corner, with a rheostat or thermostat to keep it from cooking your snake. Corns are nocturnal, for the most part. They don't bask in the sun- they crawl under things that retain heat. ZooMed or Exoterra Dessert UTHs are equally good. The Bean Farm has a basic thermostat for about $40, I think. It's made by Alife. You can find UTHs cheap on eBay.
 
Not ALL corns will stop eating (especially something as small as pinkies) before laying; it's just a general rule. Why are you feeding her pinkies? I would assume (!) that if she's big enough to be gravid she can probably handle a full grown mouse. Also, most people will recommend weekly(ish) feedings...not feeding a little Sunday and a little Tuesday...doesn't really give them time to digest properly. Are you certain that she's gravid?
 
If the pet store told you she was gravid, I wouldn't necessarily put much stock in that. Do you have any full body shots or any pics at all of her? (I looked on your profile, but couldn't find them.)

Technically, as long as you can provide an ambient temp of at least 70 and a hot spot of 80-85, the light would work, so leave it on for now, but the UTH is much better. The light will dry out the cage too much.
 
SWEETSERAPH...

Sweetseraph said:
If the pet store told you she was gravid, I wouldn't necessarily put much stock in that. Do you have any full body shots or any pics at all of her? (I looked on your profile, but couldn't find them.)

Technically, as long as you can provide an ambient temp of at least 70 and a hot spot of 80-85, the light would work, so leave it on for now, but the UTH is much better. The light will dry out the cage too much.
Click to expand...

I do have a photo album of her on my profile page.

The temps and humidity info you gave me is really appreciated. I just got one of those sets tonight, with the thermometer and the humidity gauge. The room that her Viv is in (L/R) normally stays around 60F-70F with humidity (real or manufactured) of 70-80%.

Thank you all for your help!
 
I get this message trying to get to your album: Invalid Album specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator :( But I also have an issue where I added a new profile pic that I can see on my profile, but does not show when I post, so who knows.

That humidity would probably be a little high, but with the light, it might work out. I would still recommend getting a UTH when you can.
 
SWEETSERAPH...

I'm checking into a UTH. Again, thanks for your help with this.

Well that's a bummer about my album. I'm not sure what the deal is, but I'll check into that as well.

Can you see this image of Evie?
picture.php
 
Aw! She looks like a sweet girl! But definitely overweight. Some ways to slim her down would be stair climbing, swimming, going for walks outside when the weather is warm, lots of active handling, and putting her on a diet of one medium adult mouse every 10-14 days. I'd lean toward every 14 days and see how that goes. Do you have a gram scale to track her weight?
 
Nanci said:
Aw! She looks like a sweet girl! But definitely overweight. Some ways to slim her down would be stair climbing, swimming, going for walks outside when the weather is warm, lots of active handling, and putting her on a diet of one medium adult mouse every 10-14 days. I'd lean toward every 14 days and see how that goes. Do you have a gram scale to track her weight?
Click to expand...

Good Grief! You know when the shop sold her to us, they told us that she was 'skinny' when they got her in, just two weeks before. They said they started feeding her one rat hopper twice a week to get her weight up and for the extra nutrition because of the probability of her being gravid.

And just yesterday I ordered 100 rat hopper/weanlings! So you think feeding her one of those every two weeks is good? You think she's not gravid, just fat?

I need to find out if she's gravid or not. I need to find a herpetologist in Albuquerque.

It's frustrating because I don't feel 'stupid' per se...ignorant perhaps, and just trying so hard to do the right thing for her and give her a great home. I really like Evie a lot, and even if I found out she was 10 years old I wouldn't think of giving her up or taking her back...no way!

She's getting weighed and measured this morning.

Thank you Nanci.
 
She's definitely got "hips." Have you tried palpating her to see if you can feel eggs?? She does have a bit of the prominent spine look a snake gets right before or right after it has laid eggs. I wonder if she had already laid when she came into the pet shop...
 
I have to say, October is a really strange time for a snake to be gravid. She does have bulges that "could" be eggs, but I think she is just fat.
I hate to break it to you, but for the most part, pet shops don't have a clue as to proper husbandry. But fear not! You have wandered upon THE finest corn snake site on the interwebs! :)
Just forget everything "the shop" ever told you, and listen to all of these nice people, and you and Evie will be just fine :)

Oh, and welcome to the forum!! :)
 
(((NANCI))) (((STARSEVOL)))

Thank you both!

Nanci, perhaps you're right about having already eggs...good point...it's possible.

Starsevol, Thanks for the comforting words, wise advice and words of comfort! I AM going to have to forget whatever I was told by the shop!

We just spent about 30 minutes weighing, measuring, feeling up Evie and letting her roam around the secured room with, on and about us...it was sweet! I have a few pix to post of the Mister and Evie. I personally did not feel anything that I would identify as eggs...but then, I don't really know what a gravid snake might feel like. She did however feel fatty, puffy, fluffy, saggy in her bulged area. She also had another massive poop/pee. That's her 4th in 2 days (seems like a lot...is it?).

Here's the data we collected:
Approximate (she was squirmy) Weight in 3 formats
Grams 620
1lb6oz
21.85oz
Length Approximately 53"

I'm really happy to have such a sweetly dispositioned snake and a GREAT forum to help me figure things out...get over 'new scalebabie nerves'...and to learn as much as I can.

Thank You SO Much!
 
Everything will be okay! She has a nest box- so if she _is_ gravid, she has a place to lay. If she continues to eat with a healthy appetite, I would just go ahead and feed her. If you feed her every 10 days, you can see if she is gaining weight, or losing weight. Over the course of say a month. Three or four feedings.

Have you looked around for a vet who sees reptiles? I don't think it's anything urgent, but you could take her (and one of her fresh poops) in and just get a physical for her. See if she has parasites. I wouldn't be alarmed if she does- every snake I have ever checked has had them. They are easily treated. The vet ought to be able to tell you if she is gravid. He ought to be able to feel any eggs.

But- you're prepared for her to lay if she is- so it isn't an emergency to find out if she is or not. If she is, she will go into her lay box one day and stay there until she lays. She may go in and out a few times, over a few days, until she settles in. She may _like_ the novelty of a lay box and spend time in it even if she isn't gravid. or she may show no interest. The only thing you have to worry about, a little bit, is do you want to incubate the eggs? If not, put them in the freezer for 24 hours and then dispose of them. You would have to think about are you prepared to care for an house all those hatchlings until you can sell them. If you do decide to incubate the eggs, all you really need is a spot in your house that stays around 80F. You especially don't want heat spikes up into the 90's. You can buy a simple incubator from ThinkGeek for $100.

Okay, so if she isn't gravid, just overweight- or more accurately, a little overweight and a lot out of shape, you can work on that. She probably came from a home where they did nothing but feed her. Now you have her and enjoy handling her, so exercise won't be a problem for you (and her). A healthy, big female cornsnake typically weighs between 500 and 700 grams- so she's in the right weight range, but she has those fat deposits. It would be nice to see if you could tone her up a little. And definitely not add to it!! I have not _heard of_ a snake dying from being fat, so don't get all worried, but it would be healthier for her to increase her muscle tone.
 
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