JanuaryLove
New member
I go this stuff called Hatch Right and it says not to add water. Has anyone used this before? How was it? Did it work ok? Thanks
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Has anyone used this for incubating?
- Thread starter JanuaryLove
- Start date
TripleMoonsExotic
I <3 Stripes!
Some people have had success, others have had failure. Their's a Leopard Gecko breeder in my state that lost several clutches of eggs when using that stuff. Honestly, it looks to me like is over priced perlite with this gel water crystals. Bet I could make the same stuff for a lot less then I'd pay (if I had the desire, I actually use organic soil and/or orchid moss). 
JanuaryLove
New member
Thank you so much for all the inputs! Can eggs be transfer during the incubating periods? I am thinking about using something else. Thanks again
KJUN
New member
Some people have had success, others have had failure. Their's a Leopard Gecko breeder in my state that lost several clutches of eggs when using that stuff. Honestly, it looks to me like is over priced perlite with this gel water crystals. Bet I could make the same stuff for a lot less then I'd pay (if I had the desire, I actually use organic soil and/or orchid moss).
I believe some people have gotten bad luck due to using bags with tiny holes in it. If condensation doesn't form in the box relatively quickly, the box has too much air flow, too much air space, or the media was too dry. It is NOT just perlite with "water crystals" like you use for plants or crickets. Try doing that yourself before saying such a thing. I did. Those crystals will suck moisture out of the egg LIKE CRAZY if not completely full of water. What benefit does that supply other than another way to quickly kill a clutch of eggs? Maybe they grind up the crystals super small and that is the difference - I don't know, but it is NOT the same thing. I'm not even convinced this is perlite because it holds more water, doesn't clump quite like perlite does, etc. It does look VERY similar to Perlite, though.
My conclusion is that it is too costly for large scale use when vermic/perlite works just as well (and takes up less storage space), but it does have some benefits for the novice breeder since it is more foolproof - as long as there is no hole in the bag. If condensation doesn't form in the box (to repeat myself), fix the box or add a little water. It even seems to have some advantages over vermic/perlite on LARGE colubrid eggs, and I do prefer it for that. I DO RECOMMEND it for novice or small breeders!
This is all snake recommendations. I haven't tried it on lizards, but I will.....and I suspect it'll work as advertised as long as the user has a little common sense thrown into the mix.
pgr8dnlvr
An obsolete oldie...
I used hatchrite exclusively this year. MAN I LOVE IT! The eggs were clean and nicely hydrated the whole time! I found it WASN'T very costly either. Yeah, more than vermiculite, but here's my figure on costs..
I live in Canada and was able to import and land the breeder bags for about $35 each. I incubated single clutches each in one shoebox. I was able to get about 22 clutches out of one breeder bag. I COULD have gone much more conservatively and gotten at least 25 clutches out of it I'm sure. So that was $1.40 per clutch. Average clutch being 13-15 eggs. Well that is about 14 cents per baby!
I will be posting the full results near the end of the season but more of my first clutches have hatched out and CRAZY good results. Much less molding and discolouring than anything else I've tried! Much easier to maintain humidity as well!
Rebecca
I live in Canada and was able to import and land the breeder bags for about $35 each. I incubated single clutches each in one shoebox. I was able to get about 22 clutches out of one breeder bag. I COULD have gone much more conservatively and gotten at least 25 clutches out of it I'm sure. So that was $1.40 per clutch. Average clutch being 13-15 eggs. Well that is about 14 cents per baby!
I will be posting the full results near the end of the season but more of my first clutches have hatched out and CRAZY good results. Much less molding and discolouring than anything else I've tried! Much easier to maintain humidity as well!
Rebecca
JanuaryLove
New member
That is great to know...Thanks! I will stick with it and see the results. The reason I ask is because I am expecting another clutch from my Albino female. The more input the better!
TripleMoonsExotic
I <3 Stripes!
Your assumption from lack of moisture is inaccurate. He lost the clutches from eggs molding in the stuff. I will also say as I please when I please. I think it is over priced perlite with gel water crystals. I am quite content to use orchid moss and/or organic soil.
KJUN
New member
Sure, you CAN say what you want, but I have no clue why you'd want to say anything that seems that wrong without at least trying to confirm it. If anyone thinks you might be right and tries it, they will likely kill the eggs. That's be your fault in my eyes for stating bad info.
To ANYONE else reading it, I actually tried that because I had the same suspicion. In my case, the perlite/water crystals completely collapsed the eggs in a night or three. No chance of saving them. The over-the-counter crystals were too good at absorbing moisture whenever they weren't completely saturated. They were better at it than the eggs.
I can't explain the mold - I have never seen it on SNAKE eggs, so I'd be surprised if it is common on gecko eggs. Still, I'd like to hear from THEM and not a third party...and evaluate if the mistake could have been due to something else they'd done. it is possible.
KJ
TripleMoonsExotic
I <3 Stripes!
Perhaps that was your problem in the experiment? They weren't completely saturated?
The individual in question has been breeding Leopard Geckos for several years. He's not some newbie who grabbed a bag of this crap and incubated a few clutches in it.
I am of the opinion that the stuff may be ok for lower humidity areas rather then higher humidity areas and that's why he had such a problem. Because I know of two Leo breeders out west who had success with it and zero molding. Then again who knows, maybe his bags were contaminated. :shrugs:
KJUN
New member
> Perhaps that was your problem in the experiment? They weren't completely saturated?
Maybe. I saturated them before mixed them into the rocks so I could even "smush" them smaller since you can't see large chunks in the HatchRite mix, though. It SEEMS like what was happening was that the mixture lost moisture to the air and the crystals SEEMED to suck it out of the egg in return. The eggs were able to take it back from the air fast enough. For the record, this is based on one clutch split in half. Both were incubated at 81.5-82.5F in 9" Delicups that really are rather air-tight. Normally, I never have to add water to any of these once set-up. One cup had a couple of small vent holes (smaller than a head of a push pin with a plastic round head) and one had none. Pretty much the same results.
I've left a bag of HatchRite wide open for TWO days in my back shed in 80F weather with less than 30% relative humidity....and used it without adding any moisture. It certainly wasn't saturated, but it kept the eggs plump. Water crystals will dry out a LOT in 2 days in those conditions. The HatchRite didn't. I was floored with surprise. I know my buckets of perlite and vermic need more water when I leave them out for two days in the shed, but the HatchRite did not.
> He's not some newbie who grabbed a bag of this crap and incubated a few clutches in it.
Crap? That negative of a word even though so many people had good luck with it? I'm not sure crap is a good word to describe it. If I tried moss where I live, I could be calling it crap. That doesn't make it crap - it just won't work in our situation.
> I am of the opinion that the stuff may be ok for lower humidity areas rather then higher humidity areas and that's why he had such a problem. Because I know of two Leo breeders out west who had success with it and zero molding. Then again who knows, maybe his bags were contaminated.
Rob seems to like it, and I put a lot of weight on his opinion. He's in a rather humid environment. I don't know about his house, but our snake room was always TOO HUMID when we lived in LA further from the big waters than him. When we lived pretty darn close to the coast, the walls dripped.....lol. I'm the opposite now. I'm not in the desert, but our humidity is low enough that I have to run a humidifier at times to get the snakes to shed correctly. Two ends of the spectrum there, but this is on SNAKES again. Not lizards (unless Rob has done it), but I plan to put my leopard geckos eggs on it just to TRY it out! So, I'm not sure this alone can be the difference. ....at least not with snakes. I believe the OP was asking about snakes and not lizards, but I'm too lazy to check.
I believe some people (NOT YOU) are against it because it DOES help....and hatching eggs was one part that some beginners had trouble with. I've gotten that feeling when some of the big breeders start putting it down. Me? I'm not going to pay its price for all of my clutches when I can use my vermic/perlite mixture for MUCH less and very little added actual benefit. I DO plan to use it on some of the harder-to-hatch LARGER colubrid eggs, though, because I think its advantages really shine. BUT, those pituophis can use up one of those small bags completely on just one clutch! LOL
As far as mold? I've never seen it on a fertile egg in HatchRite. Of course, I've only used a dozen bags or so total.
Maybe. I saturated them before mixed them into the rocks so I could even "smush" them smaller since you can't see large chunks in the HatchRite mix, though. It SEEMS like what was happening was that the mixture lost moisture to the air and the crystals SEEMED to suck it out of the egg in return. The eggs were able to take it back from the air fast enough. For the record, this is based on one clutch split in half. Both were incubated at 81.5-82.5F in 9" Delicups that really are rather air-tight. Normally, I never have to add water to any of these once set-up. One cup had a couple of small vent holes (smaller than a head of a push pin with a plastic round head) and one had none. Pretty much the same results.
I've left a bag of HatchRite wide open for TWO days in my back shed in 80F weather with less than 30% relative humidity....and used it without adding any moisture. It certainly wasn't saturated, but it kept the eggs plump. Water crystals will dry out a LOT in 2 days in those conditions. The HatchRite didn't. I was floored with surprise. I know my buckets of perlite and vermic need more water when I leave them out for two days in the shed, but the HatchRite did not.
> He's not some newbie who grabbed a bag of this crap and incubated a few clutches in it.
Crap? That negative of a word even though so many people had good luck with it? I'm not sure crap is a good word to describe it. If I tried moss where I live, I could be calling it crap. That doesn't make it crap - it just won't work in our situation.
> I am of the opinion that the stuff may be ok for lower humidity areas rather then higher humidity areas and that's why he had such a problem. Because I know of two Leo breeders out west who had success with it and zero molding. Then again who knows, maybe his bags were contaminated.
Rob seems to like it, and I put a lot of weight on his opinion. He's in a rather humid environment. I don't know about his house, but our snake room was always TOO HUMID when we lived in LA further from the big waters than him. When we lived pretty darn close to the coast, the walls dripped.....lol. I'm the opposite now. I'm not in the desert, but our humidity is low enough that I have to run a humidifier at times to get the snakes to shed correctly. Two ends of the spectrum there, but this is on SNAKES again. Not lizards (unless Rob has done it), but I plan to put my leopard geckos eggs on it just to TRY it out! So, I'm not sure this alone can be the difference. ....at least not with snakes. I believe the OP was asking about snakes and not lizards, but I'm too lazy to check.
I believe some people (NOT YOU) are against it because it DOES help....and hatching eggs was one part that some beginners had trouble with. I've gotten that feeling when some of the big breeders start putting it down. Me? I'm not going to pay its price for all of my clutches when I can use my vermic/perlite mixture for MUCH less and very little added actual benefit. I DO plan to use it on some of the harder-to-hatch LARGER colubrid eggs, though, because I think its advantages really shine. BUT, those pituophis can use up one of those small bags completely on just one clutch! LOL
As far as mold? I've never seen it on a fertile egg in HatchRite. Of course, I've only used a dozen bags or so total.
TripleMoonsExotic
I <3 Stripes!
Ahhh! Now see, you didn't say that.
It's one thing to have experimented with several clutches, but just two half clutches with negative results from your experiment isn't enough for me to say 100% it's not possible (or in this case, that's not all HatchRite is). I understand why you didn't do more because it would stink to loose that many clutches...BUT if they're monitored closely I imagine you can catch the problem quickly enough so no major damage is done. I think maybe the crushing of the dried out crystals might be an idea to make it work. I'm game for trying it next season with a few clutches...Perhaps instead of entire clutches, just taking 2-3 eggs per container for the experiment so the experiment can be stretched a bit more.
KJUN
New member
My cheapest clutches average probably $50 per baby as a minimum (retail). I honestly can't think of anything less valuable than that except for a few females I am selling off this season). Since I do everything with the double tests (air holes versus no air holes), I'd be looking at $200-300 loses to due 2-3 eggs per box. PLUS, who cares? Vermic/perlite works. HatchRite has always worked for me. That did NOT work. It did not work with an amazing amount of failure. Feel free to further experiment - different crystal sizes might make the world of difference, but that still doesn't explain why HatchRite doesn't clump like Perlite if all it is is Perlite??? It also seems to hold moisture better than perlite or free crystals. Also, pop the top, and the rh humity returns back to 98-99% MUCH faster with HatchRite than with Perlite/Vermic. I have tested that numerous times with my gauges.
Also, someone with a bag of perlite, see if it says that it contains a small amount of asbestos. It seems like it would have to if it were regular old Perlite since all the perlite I've used is listed as having 1% or so of it. That dust is "dangerous" so consumers usually get warned.
In conclusion, there is no evidence that this is JUST regular perlite with regular water crystals. The "rocks" look like Perlite (and may be), but i've never seen a single water crystal in a bag! There are strong indications that it is not "just" that if it is that at all. It might look like it, but petrol looks like concentrated bleach, but that don't make it so. Everclear looks like water, but I wouldn't recommend putting it in a 5 gal cooler at work! LOL.
KJ
Also, someone with a bag of perlite, see if it says that it contains a small amount of asbestos. It seems like it would have to if it were regular old Perlite since all the perlite I've used is listed as having 1% or so of it. That dust is "dangerous" so consumers usually get warned.
In conclusion, there is no evidence that this is JUST regular perlite with regular water crystals. The "rocks" look like Perlite (and may be), but i've never seen a single water crystal in a bag! There are strong indications that it is not "just" that if it is that at all. It might look like it, but petrol looks like concentrated bleach, but that don't make it so. Everclear looks like water, but I wouldn't recommend putting it in a 5 gal cooler at work! LOL.
KJ