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heresy, taboo, or nightmare? Quad het pairings

omni

omni

antiunresemiretirismic
I'm buying a Ghost male, and was curious what possible offspring he could sire with my females, so after plugging Ghost and Blizzard into Mick's progeny predictor, it comes back 100% Norms het Amel/Anery/Charcoal/Hypo. Quad hets... Yay!
NOT!
If you have the program, try it. And now you'll see what I'm talking about. Plug those quad het normals back in.:eek:

I may someday try this pairing, but the problem is ID'ing the Charcoals from the Anerys. The babies could be verrry similiar. No guarantee you could tell which one was Anery or Charcoal. That, aside for everything being possble het this and or that, and the different clutch you would get with every breeding.
Just because the variety you could have in one clutch would make it kinda fun to see.
So should I be warned not to try this future pairing of Ghost x Blizzard and then breeding offspring back? Anyone ever do that, or have thought about it?
 
This year I am breeding a trio of normals......
het hypo, lavender and diffused
possibly het charcoal, anery and amel.

Try THAT in the genetic calculator! :)
 
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I know many people have attempted and succeeded (as far as we know) at telling anery and charcoal apart. There are certain distinctions that can be seen at birth. I believe it's when you start throwing other genes into the mix that things get complicated. Is it a ghost or a phantom? Blizzard or Snow? Or maybe it's both?! @_@ Or.. maybe even a Phantom Snow?!?! x_x

I know that this has happened at least once in the attempt to create what was temporarily called a 'Diamond' Corn, Lava Charcoal. The first was bred, sent off for testing, and ended up being an Ice instead of the Diamond. Thus is life.

I think that it really can be done if someone has enough experience hatching out the two morphs and becoming familiar with the common variations amoung the two, but even then it can be a very big mess.:shrugs:
 
The upper hand you'd have is knowing that they were either anery a or charcoal. At least then you could test them out, or at least be able to make an educated guess based on appearance. It can be done with younger corns very easily sometimes, then again sometimes not so easy.

Here's a thread that can help
http://cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60208&highlight=charcoal+anery

Having a bit of insight to their background helps. I bought a "Snopal" female as a snow, but she grew up looking like a blizzard. So understandably, I questioned the seller (who could offer no insight, as she was not the breeder) and I bred her to a charcoal... she threw normals. The next year, i bred her to a het anery (had no homo anery males), she only threw half anerys and a few snows, but these snows looked nothing like her. I even kept a few just to see if they went patternless like her. None of them did. Then, at the advice of a friend, I did a breeding loan with his lav het anery male the 3rd year... bingo! I finally figured out what she was! So there was 3 breeding years taken up just to find out what genetics she carried! So if you know what genes are going into the mix in the first place, then you are one step ahead of many!

And also, to add a post to your other thread without having to make 2 posts...

The charcoal gene will catch up... don't you worry. I'm working on Striped Pewters and Motley Phantoms myself. I know Joe has already produced a few Sunkissed Charcoals that are FANTASTIC looking, and the pattern morphs are catching up as well. There are also a couple of people that are working on integrating morphs such as Ultra, Ultramel, and Lava into Charcoal as well. Its a-comin! Just wait!
 
omni said:
So should I be warned not to try this future pairing of Ghost x Blizzard and then breeding offspring back? Anyone ever do that, or have thought about it?
Click to expand...
If you want to try that breeding , just do !! You can breed a part of the offspring back to mom or dad and some to each other to get a clutch off eggs like magic balls ( what color will be next )
 
Original post by omni
....I may someday try this pairing, but the problem is ID'ing the Charcoals from the Anerys.
Click to expand...

The difficulty would not be recognizing the Anery 'a' from Anery 'b' aka Charcoal siblings, it would be in identifying any that were homzygous Anery + Charcoal. :bang:

Charcoal hatchling:

charcoal06textbi7.jpg


Anery 'a' hatchling:

02aneryhblood106129mtext3lv5.jpg


Note the eye colour of the Charcoal.

Lex
 
Original post by starsevol
I'm sorry, I can't see it.
Click to expand...

Charcoal has black eye - black pupil + iris is dark. Giving an attractive 'large eye' appearance.

Anery 'a' - dark pupil with pale iris highlight.

Hope this helps ya.

Lex
 
starsevol said:
I'm sorry, I can't see it. Can you post a better pic of a charcoal's eye?

Thank you :)
Click to expand...

It is a little hard to see in those pics, but in real life it's very obvious. Charcoals have nearly solid black eyes, there is minimal color difference between their iris and pupil. Whereas anerys have much lighter irises compared to their pupils.

As for the OP, multi-hets can be fun. It's exciting to see what hatches out! I'll be producing butter bloods this year and am planning on breeding one to a ghost stripe just for the fun of it. Normals het anery, amel, caramel, hypo, stripe, and bloodred. It'll be exciting watching the colors that come out! I say go for it!
 
is the eye color thing an exact thing? like it will tell you 99 percent of the time?

i had a hard time trying to see if my unknown corn was charcoal or anery....

i finally settled on Anery.

Ashley
 
Well, good luck! My original Charcoal Ghost project had 'A' Anerythrism in it and I wound up putting question marks on quite a few animals.
 
Thank you guys a wicked lot :)
This willgreatly help me, as I have a trio I'm breeding this year, 50% het anery AND charcoal!
 
As discussed, it's the double homozygous Anery A+B that will confuse the hell out of you.

Something else to look for in charcoals, and I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet, but it does seem to be common in every charcoal I've seen, picture or in person:

- Charcoal babies have an unmistakeable BLUE color in their head. Aneries have simple reflective irridescence.
- Charcoal babies have a pink stripe right behind their eye, which in Aneries, tends to be either black or grey.

I'm not saying the second one is going to happen every single time, but I bet dollars to doughnuts that if people take a look at all of their pictures of known Anery B's, they will see the pink stripe. ;)
 
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