How many genarations?

[Isak]

Hi!
I'm trying to decide what cornsnake morphs i'm going to buy this year....i'm sure about 1.2 lavender hatchlings and i'm thinking of a fourth corn but i don't know what morph....I was thinkin why not like hypomelanistic...cause it would be exciting to produce new morph by myself instead of buying the trait ready to just breed and sell the same trait. I've never done that cause i know that it takes at least 2 generations to get the wanted offspring. But when i were thinking i thought if i cross lavender and hypo i will get normal het. hypo & lavender. And if i cross that offspring i would get 25% chance of getting lavender hypo....but that was not right apparently? I tried the cornsnakeprogram and it said a whole different thing, it said that the offspring of breeding normals that were het. hypo and lavender would be only 6,25% chance of being hypo lavenders! And the rest lots of different het's.
I wonder the same thing about crossing lavender and butter..there the program said that only 1,56 % of the hatchlings would be butter lavender or amel lavender(opal).
HOW many generations does it take to get the traits that you want so you can save those hatclings and breed them to get 100% of that trait the next generation?

Does anyone have a idea of what trait has not been breed to lavender that could be a intressting mix?...cause if im going to breed lavender to something else to try make a morph by myself for the first time why not a new morph that nobody has tried?

This maybe hard to read and understand with all at the same time but if u do understand it and know anything about it please reply!

Thanks!

 

[Chip]

Not to be a horses' #*!

But there is no morph available that you could mix that has never been done before. However, you could do the exact same breeding that's been done 1000 times and get a result that NO ONE HAS EVER SEEN!
It gets a little more complicated than that. You would almost certainly have to hold back many hatchlings to adulthood to see how they would come out. And if you did get an unusual enough morph, you couldn't rightly "name" it unless you could re-create it... that means to produce it so that at least a percentage of offspring from like parents would consistenly turn out with these "new" traits.
Now as for how to get certain animals to have hatchling populations %100, you CAN'T. . Well, always. If you have an animal that is homozygous for a gene and another that isn't, you can't bank on anything. But it even gets more complicated. If you are dealing with muliple traits (say, motley and amel) it takes breeding trails to determine what animals are h/z for BOTH. And there are things such as sunglow, rev. Okeetee, etc, that aren't even TRAITS. Umm, read the cornsnake manual and let KAT or one of the more experienced genetics experts chime in.
I tried to make things simple, but should've just left this one for the genetics pros.

 

[Isak]

hehe...okay

yeah...it's still very complicated....but if i understand right you're saying that for example, i cross anery "A" and amel...after 2 generations wouldn't i get some snowcorn offspring? in that case this is hard.....=P

Anyway thanks!

 

[Serpwidgets]

Hmm, when combining multiple traits, yes, it'll take you two generations to recover them all into one individual.

The trick is, the odds of recovering one simple-recessive trait (amel, lavender, caramel, etc) from het parents is 1 in 4 per offspring. The bigger trick is that each of those 1 in 4 chances (per trait) is independent of any other traits. So with hypo X lav, then breeding the hets together, each has a 1/4 chance of being lav, and 1/4 chance of being hypo. That comes out to 1 in 16. (that's the "6.25%" result.)

When working with hets, it quadruples for each trait. With three traits it's 1 in 64, four traits is 1 in 256, etc.

The reason you got such horrible odds on "butter X lavender" is that butter is not a trait, it's the combination of two traits: caramel and amel.

IMO you have the right idea though, you sound like you want to produce something expressing the traits so that you can make full clutches of those same offspring.

Lavender Caramel, Lavender Bloodred, Lavender Charcoal, and Lavender Motley are all either nonexistant or extremely rare at this point. (Who knows what a lavender charcoal or lavender caramel might look like.)

Cross any one of those traits with a lav to produce your (F1 generation) hets, and then raise up a few and work on producing the second (F2) generation combined-morphs. Since it's 1 in 16 odds per egg at getting the desired "double morph" result, it may take a few clutches to produce a breeding pair of them.

 

[Isak]

THANKS!

U totaly understanded me right! Thank you!
I dont think hard enough!.....i thught that it was 25% chance of getting the wanted trait after 2 generations.....on 100 lave X hypo. eggs wouldn't it be 25% hypo, 25% lav, 25% normal het. hypo & Lav,25% hypoLav?? I don't get it...im with u until 1 in 16 chance of being the wanted trait.....You wrote: The bigger trick is that each of those 1 in 4 chances (per trait) is independent of any other traits....i dont get that one right....it's kinda hard for me cause it's pretty weird words for a swedish 15 year old person ....if u can explain that "bigger trick to me a little more detailed i'll think I'll get it" .................5 minutes later:

I GET IT!!!! So in 20 eggs there is 1 in 4 to get hypo X lav and in those eggs there is once agian 1 in 4 to get hypo X lav??
I hope im right...heheh. But why is there a 1 in 4 chance again in those eggs? Do u have to say 1 in 16 just to be more precisely?

Wery thankul for the reply...and more thankful for another one

 

[Isak]

I've got it!

Later I went to your website..it rules! I totaly understand the double mutant genetic now....I have to breed every hatchling to each other and hope for the best....that will be a lot of normals.....In sweden the market for corns is not so great..it'll be hard to sell all those sub-adult corn after breeding the f2 generation......If it were easy to sell them...i would try create new morph every year
I don't know about trying to create a own morph....it worries me that u have to breed every to each other..and if u have bad luck the ae adn the other ae is both males or both females..then it's realy Annoying! I saw the most nicest corn ever today! Lavender, Okeete and Amel. Aztec's on this page http://www.boakingdom.com/cornsnake.html
The pic of the lavender aztec were in a old post =)...found it when i were searching for lavender posts =).
Once agian, YOUR WEBSITE ROCK'S!!! Now i have a chance of trying to figure out what i will get if i cross ........ with ............
Mabye I will try to create a new morph.....maybe not...what du u think, in relation of the bad corn market in sweden...the f1 is no problem cause u get all same hatchlings...but the f2.....I'll have to think for a while..

Thanks allot!