Question re: who should I breed with whom?

[michmak]

Hi everyone -
New to the forum, can't figure out this genetics stuff (it's too logical for me) so I hope y'all can make recommendations for me - I am currently growing my snake collection and plan on breeding them eventually. Right now, I have three males - a beautiful charcoal corn, a motley red albino, and a reverse Okeetee. I have seven females - an albino jungle corn (gorgeous colors of pale yellow, peach and white), a ruby-eyes ghost, a snow with lots of pink, a high-yellow creamsicle, an Anery A, a motley Okeetee and a normal Okeetee. When the time comes, which males should I breed to which females? Also, should I be getting another couple of snake morphs and if so, what? I have no idea what these ones are het for (if anything) but I just love them and have become obsessed.
Any advice is surely appreciated!

Mich

 

[Amanda E]

What I would do:


Option 1 - Without getting more snakes...

Charcoal male x Snow female = Normals Het Charcoal Het Anery Het Amelanisic (if you breed these babies together you have the possibilty to get Normals, Amels, Anerys, Charcoals, Blizzards, and Snows)

Motley Albino male x Motley Okeetee female = Motleys Het Amelanisic

Motley Albino male x Ghost female = Normals Het Motley Het Amel Het Anery Het Hypo (if you breed these babies together you have the possibilty to get Normals, Hypos, Amels, Anerys, Ghosts, Snows, Coral Snows, and all of the above combined with motley)

Reverse Okeetee male x Okeetee female = Okeetees Het Amelanisic


Option 2 - Getting more snakes...

I would get a Creamsicle male, and a male Snow of some sort (maybe a Coral Snow or Motley Snow), a female that has Charcoal in it (Bloodred het Charcoal, Pewter, Blizzard, etc.), maybe an Okeetee male.

These next suggestions don't necessarily go with your current animals, but, I would definitely recommend getting some other morphs that are of things you don't have yet, like a Caramel based morph (a good one for you would be a Butter, since you have a lot of amel based morphs), a Bloodred based morph (like the Pewter I mentioned), and a Lavendar based morph, like an Opal for instance.


I would not ever breed the Albino Jungle because it's a hybrid (just keep it as a pet), but that's just my opinion.


I hope this helps you.

 

[paulh]

I would not breed either the jungle corn or the creamsicle. Keep them as non-breeding pets. And I wouldn't get a creamsicle male.

Most of the possible matings of your present stock would produce normal looking babies that are heterozygous for various mutant genes.

I'd mate the reverse Okeetee male to both the motley Okeetee and the Okeetee. Then all the babies would be Okeetees, and I like their bright colors. The babies could be used to produce motley Okeetees and reverse Okeetees, and even motley reverse Okeetees.

The amelanistic motley x snow would produce amelanistic babies. It would also be a good test to see if the amelanistic motley is heterozygous for anerythristic and to see if the snow is heterozygous for motley.

The amelanistic motley x anerythristic would produce normal babies. It would be a good test to see if the amelanistic motley is heterozygous for anerythristic and to see if the anerythristic is heterozygous for either amelanistic or motley.

I'd prefer not to mate the charcoal male to any of the anerythristic females just to keep the charcoal and anerythristic mutants separate. Like Amanda E., I'd get a charcoal or charcoal-combination morph female for him. And I might add a ghost male for the ghost female.

Good luck.

 

[michmak]

Why not breed the Albino Jungle or Creamsicle?

Thanks for your replies - I'll eventually muddle my way through all the various genes / breeding options / etc... it's absolutely fascinating! I am wondering why you both recommend not breeding the Albino Jungle and / or the creamsicle, as color-wise these are my two most beautiful snakes. I realize the Jungle Corn has some King Snake in it's family tree (didn't realize the creamsicle did, though - learn something new everyday!) but does this make them harder to breed, or is it just not advisable? If so, why not? Just curious - not trying to disregard your helpful advice. The more I can learn the better informed I will be, and I don't want to do anything that will endanger my snakes. I look forward to breeding them, but they are my babies first and foremost and I wouldn't want to do anything to harm them.

Mich

 

[pcar]

It isn't that everyone is saying that you can't breed the Jungle and the Creamsicle. You can breed them together. It is just that you will then have non-pure corn hatchlings in your collections. Not that this is a bad thing. I agree with you that they are very eye appealing.

 

[CAV]

I realize the Jungle Corn has some King Snake in it's family tree (didn't realize the creamsicle did, though - learn something new everyday!)

Creams aren't from Kingsnake parentage. They are the result of crossing a Cornsnake and Great Plains Ratsnake (E.g. emoryi).

 

[Amanda E]

Why not breed the Albino Jungle or Creamsicle?

Go ahead and breed them if you want, but I've found that Jungles have a very small market. Most people wont even take in a FREE hybrid snake, at least where I'm from. I do think that jungles are very pretty, but if I had one I would just keep it for the asthetic value and let others breed for hybrids. Many people don't like others breeding hybrids because they are scared that they may end up unknowingly buying a cornsnake that has kingsnake blood in it, and then later when they breed it, they notice kingsnake attributes in the babies and then realize they just spent a lot of money feeding and breeding this animal only to have it muddy their own pure cornsnake bloodlines. I'm not saying that you would sell a hybrid as a pure corn, but what if the person you sell it to later sells it as a pure corn?

As far as creamsicles, the reason is similar to the above example, only in this case it's an example of an intergrade rather than a hybrid. I personally have no problem with creamsicles, but obviously Paul is one of those people who include intergrades as animals to stay away from.

 

[paulh]

Yes, I consider man-made subspecies crosses undesirable. I also believe that sooner or later the Great Plains rat snake will be raised to full species level rather than the subspecies rank that it has now. As for beauty, I lust for Okeetees with DayGlo red and yellow colors that can paralyze the optic nerve at 50 paces.

 

[Bibz]

Well for the cream and jungle corn, what you could do is to breed them toghether, i have NO idea what it would give or if it's possible (it should be tho). That would give you some probably weird snakes since it would have corn, king and emory in it, and since it was already an hybrid (wich i dont have problems with, as long as we know what it is) i might be something fun to start with. Just be sure to label them as hybrid when you sell them away so that people don't mitsake them for 'pure' snakes

by the way you can really cool looking snakes with hybryding i saw some AMAZING pictures of Jungle corns