quick question about brumation...

[MastersHaven]

hello guys...
I have a quick question about brumating...

Do you brumate your yearlings and if so do you use the same methods as with your adult breeders? (i.e. lenght of time, temps etc.)

what is an ideal brumation weight going in and coming out?

my adults were already brumated when I got them this spring and I did not brumate my hatchlings (they were only 5 months old) so now that everyone is older and bigger I was wondering if I should indeed go ahead and brumate the yearlings so that their systems will be ready for next years brumation?

I had read over a thread of posts about brumation just the other day but I dont remember seeing a minimal age for brumation given in neither the thread or in my books...

I appreciate your responces...
Thanks in advance!

 

[princess]

There's no need to brumate your snake if it's not going to brreed the next year but it won't do it any harm either. If you brumate your hatchlings, you'd take the same steps adn do it all the same way. This might mean it eventually takes them a smidge longer to get to breeding age but if a fast turnaround breeding isn't important to you, it might be a nice break from feeding and cleaning!

I've never brumated my snakes that aren't coming up to a breeding but I've been thinking about it with a few of my yearlings (2004's) that are too small to breed in 2006 as I think it would be nice to have the winter off. That way I'll only be feeding a handfull of 2005's (and cleaning up after them!)

 

[MastersHaven]

ok... so... it wont hurt to brumate yearlings (04's)?

another question.... I have read many times that it depends on the snakes size and not really the age as to when is begins breeding... what is the average age/size for a snake to start breeding?

 

[princess]

True, The general rule is 3 years old, 300 grams and 3 feet long but it's not a hard and fast rule. I am very strict about weight and so far I've only bred girls that are well over 300g but one I bred this year was only about 22 months old when she layed her eggs, making her 2 years old when they hatched. She gave me 10 lovely eggs and had no trouble, she was about 340g and pushing 4 foot when I paired her up.

I have a ghost who is about 15 months old now and gets one adult mouse every 7 days or so and she's already nearing 300g (about 270 at last weigh in 3 weeks ago). She'll be brumated in a few months and I'm sure she'll be up around 350 or more when she is mated in february. I have another who is 2 months younger and weighs about 120g...it's an individual thing...some are faster to grow without being power fed.

<Go ahead and brumate your younger ones that won't breed next year if you like. It won't do them any harm and it'll give you the winter off!

 

[Jynx]

With males, you can normally start them whenever they're ready and willing lol! Smaller males usually result in lower fertility rates though. Females: general rule is 3ft/300g.

I normally put my yearlings down for a slight brunmation, with just a small change in temp and a change in the photoperiod, but they do not go down for the full blown (or as "full blown" as I get) sleep that my adults go into.

EDIT: Princess you speed typer!!!!

 

[MastersHaven]

Thanks for the input guys....

I was just wondering because the adults that I have now were purchased as adults and had been brumated and already in the breeding process when I got them... they are only 03's and have already given clutches (one had a single clutch of 8 fertile eggs and the other double clutched 13 fertile eggs the first time but the second clutch was all (8) slugs -- I am assuming it's because I didn't give her access to the male after her first clutch.

it seemed kind of young to me for them to be clutching but they both are over early 03's so I guess thats ok...

I have 6 others that are older but all of the others are 04's and 05's ... the 05's I will not be brumating but the 04's I had questions about... most of these guys are averaging about 2 1/2' so based on what you guys have said I dont think that a light brumation will hurt them...

as for weight, I need to get some dependable digital scales.... I had searched the forum for input and came up with some good prospects.... now if I can just stop spending money buying snakes long enough to go get some... LOL

thanks again guys,

 

[paulh]

Rule of thumb: think about what happens in the wild.

Brumation of corn snakes of any age is beneficial but not mandatory. This includes yearlings. If I brumated a yearling, I would use the same conditions as for an adult.

For other species, such as Pituophis and garter snakes from the northern half of the USA, I consider brumation mandatory for yearlings.

I can't give an ideal brumation weight. But I'd put off brumation for any snake with hunger folds.

Minimum brumation age is two months and at least four meals. The food gives the babies the reserves needed to get through brumation. That has worked for California king snake babies, and they came through fine. I do not recall brumating any corn snake babies.

In my opinion, size and age are interrelated, though size seems more heavily weighted. In the wild, North American colubrids generally start breeding in the third spring. For minimum breeding size, assume the low end of the average size range of adults given for each species in Conant and Collins' field guide.

Hope this helps.