SNAKESRCOOL
New member
Can anybody tell me what genes a reverse okeetee carries, is it basically an amel?
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reverse okeetee
- Thread starter SNAKESRCOOL
- Start date
SNAKESRCOOL
New member
Thanks for the info. 
SNAKESRCOOL
New member
I'm never going to understand all the differences. some snakes seem to fall into so many possibles, to my untrained eye
Clint Boyer
'Former' Snake slave
Those saddles are too red to be a Creamsicle.
Definately a Reverse Okeetee.
Definately a Reverse Okeetee.
SNAKESRCOOL
New member
if i breed a reverse okeetee with a anerytristic, the babys will be normal het for snow yes???
will they look normal or mite they have an okeetee pattern and if i was then to breed the young would they produce snows or snows with an okeetee pattern?
will they look normal or mite they have an okeetee pattern and if i was then to breed the young would they produce snows or snows with an okeetee pattern?
CornCrazy
What's one more???
SNAKESRCOOL said:
Yes...you will get normals het snow unless one or both of the parents are het for the trait that the other parent is displaying. It is possible that some of the babies will look somewhat like okeetees. It is also possible that some of the snows from breeding the young would have an okeetee look, as well.
SNAKESRCOOL
New member
ok thanks, i'm confident that one day i will have at least a basic understanding of all this
Tracee
Grrrl
Yes it is, I posted a picture of a reverse okeetee for SNAKESRCOOL.Clint Boyer said:
CAV, I have seen many pics of reverse okeetees like the one I earlier attached, and my snakey is definitely not a one of those whatever the breeder says! He has no white borders that are so apparent on ROs and his patterns are exactly like those of a creamsicle. It did confuzzle me for a while though.
Clint Boyer
'Former' Snake slave
I misunderstood, I thought you meant the pic you posted was snakey and it was a Creamsicle.
Darin Chappell
Very Senior Hillbilly
All corns are rat snakes, but not all rat snakes are corns.
Creamsicles are an amelanistic hybrid cross between the Great Plains Rat snake (Pantherophis emoryi) and the cornsnake (Pantherophis guttata); any percentage of the two species mixed is irrelevant to the question. An amel that 99% corn and 1% emoryi, really ought to still be called a Creamsicle, as would an animal that was 99% emory and only 1% corn.
Yes, there are other hybrid "corns" out there, but they are all in the creamsicle "family." That is, they are the non-amelanistic crosses between emoryi and cornsnakes. Rootbeer corns are what many call the normally colored crosses, and I have seen hypo crosses referred to as Creamsoda corns. I am certain there are others.
As for the animal in the latest picture shown by Tracee, unless you have specific reason to believe that there is emoryi blood in its background, I can't say that I see any emoryi influence at all. The saddles are not the typical emoryi shape, and the coloration is still too red to be what I would expect from a creamsicle. It is definitely not what most people think of when they consider a reverse okeetee in their minds' eye, but I see no emoryi influence there.
Creamsicles are an amelanistic hybrid cross between the Great Plains Rat snake (Pantherophis emoryi) and the cornsnake (Pantherophis guttata); any percentage of the two species mixed is irrelevant to the question. An amel that 99% corn and 1% emoryi, really ought to still be called a Creamsicle, as would an animal that was 99% emory and only 1% corn.
Yes, there are other hybrid "corns" out there, but they are all in the creamsicle "family." That is, they are the non-amelanistic crosses between emoryi and cornsnakes. Rootbeer corns are what many call the normally colored crosses, and I have seen hypo crosses referred to as Creamsoda corns. I am certain there are others.
As for the animal in the latest picture shown by Tracee, unless you have specific reason to believe that there is emoryi blood in its background, I can't say that I see any emoryi influence at all. The saddles are not the typical emoryi shape, and the coloration is still too red to be what I would expect from a creamsicle. It is definitely not what most people think of when they consider a reverse okeetee in their minds' eye, but I see no emoryi influence there.
Tracee
Grrrl
How very confuzzling! So the breeder could have been right and he is a reverse okeetee, just without the typical characteristics..?
(On deciding he didn't look at all like a reverse okeetee, I set about finding out what he was, as ya do. Bought a few books to compare pictures, and creamsicles looked like a perfect match to me. Though I'm starting to doubt that now!! And I presumed that if corns were rats, rats were also corns.)
:dunce:
So the breeder could have been right and he is a reverse okeetee, just without the typical characteristics..? (On deciding he didn't look at all like a reverse okeetee, I set about finding out what he was, as ya do. Bought a few books to compare pictures, and creamsicles looked like a perfect match to me. Though I'm starting to doubt that now!! And I presumed that if corns were rats, rats were also corns.)
:dunce:
Darin Chappell
Very Senior Hillbilly
Don't get me wrong, it may very well be a creamsicle. If the colors are not showing up truly on my monitor, then my impression could be entirely wrong-headed. But, if the animal is as red as he looks to me, and you have no overt evidence that makes you suspect emoryi blood to be present, I wouldn't jump to that conclusion.
The animal is not reverse okeetee (I hate that name!), as they are commonly defined, but that is not bad at all, because if he has as little white as he appears to have, he may well be better identified as a Sunglow. They're all just names of description, anyway. Reverse okeetees, sunglows, and candy canes are all just amels for the most part anyway, and the variations present are either the result of line breeding or pure happenstance.
As to the rats are corns/corns are rats thing, let me put it this way. All dogs are mamals, but not all mamals are dogs, right? "Rats" is a generic name that is applied to Pantherophis: guttata, obsoleta, emoryi, quadrivatta, and who knows how many other species of snake in North America. Not to mention all of the Old World Rats that are still listed in the Elaphe classification.
Hope that helps a bit to clarify what I was trying to say before...
The animal is not reverse okeetee (I hate that name!), as they are commonly defined, but that is not bad at all, because if he has as little white as he appears to have, he may well be better identified as a Sunglow. They're all just names of description, anyway. Reverse okeetees, sunglows, and candy canes are all just amels for the most part anyway, and the variations present are either the result of line breeding or pure happenstance.
As to the rats are corns/corns are rats thing, let me put it this way. All dogs are mamals, but not all mamals are dogs, right? "Rats" is a generic name that is applied to Pantherophis: guttata, obsoleta, emoryi, quadrivatta, and who knows how many other species of snake in North America. Not to mention all of the Old World Rats that are still listed in the Elaphe classification.
Hope that helps a bit to clarify what I was trying to say before...
CornCrazy
What's one more???
leia,
There are also other corn hybrids. Jungle corns are cal king X corn snake hybrids. There are even more, as well. I think that the emoryi X gutatta crosses cause the most confusion, though. It can be quite hard to visually tell if a snake has emoryi blood in it.
There are also other corn hybrids. Jungle corns are cal king X corn snake hybrids. There are even more, as well. I think that the emoryi X gutatta crosses cause the most confusion, though. It can be quite hard to visually tell if a snake has emoryi blood in it.
Darin Chappell
Very Senior Hillbilly
You're right, of course. I almost included jungle corns (and all of the other "mixes" possible), but I didn't, because I haven't seen anyone trying to pass those hybrids off as cornsnakes to anyone.
In that regard, I think the emoryi crosses stand alone and pose the biggest "threat" to those who are trying not to introduce "foreign" blood into their cornsnake breedings. I could be wrong, however.
In that regard, I think the emoryi crosses stand alone and pose the biggest "threat" to those who are trying not to introduce "foreign" blood into their cornsnake breedings. I could be wrong, however.