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substrate question

tina

New member
A friend of mine uses sani chips as beddingfor her corns, so when looking online I found these sani chips (or habi chips) at AAA reptile supply and LLLReptile and Supply and bought a huge bag from LLL. They are hardwood chips, sanitized etc good for ease of cleaning out and looks nice a la aspen. After reading several recent threads on substrate I decided to ask them what actual wood is used, since neither of them say. The response was pine mostly and ideal for corns. I have set up my terrarium with them, should i return them, use them or what?
Thanks
Tina:confused:
 
Yes I do and have read it avidly, many times. I guess the problem is both of the reptile supply places did not list the type of wood and both said it was good to use for snakes. My problem was not not reading the manual but trusting a reptile supply site that they would be upfront and not steer someone wrong. I guess i was too trusting.
Tina
 
That was a very good thread to post! Glad I had the chance to read it.

I myself use a mix of reptibark and forest bed for my hatchlings/yearlings who are in glass tanks or rubbermaids. It's very attractive and the babies love burrowing! I did try this with my customs, but it was a HUGE pain to clean it. They're way too heavy to lift and dump out. I was thinking about skipping the forest bed and just useing the reptibark, rinsing it real well to get rid of the dust.

I did like the look of that aspen bedding though. Is it really dusty? More expensive then reptibark? I'm going to search around online tonight to investigate!
 
Ummm...do you all know that Aspen IS a type of pine? It's just a type that isn't toxic. Ask the company you got it from if it contains aspen pine. If it does, then you should be OK using it. If it doesn't, then I would send it back.
 
Aspen is not a type of pine. It is a poplar.

This
aspen.jpg

is an aspen leaf.
 
blckkat said:


I did like the look of that aspen bedding though. Is it really dusty? More expensive then reptibark? I'm going to search around online tonight to investigate!

I havn't found Aspen to be too dusty. I use Aspen for my Corns and Kings and Repti-Bark for the Pythons. Aspen is less expensive then the Repti-Bark but the Repti-Bark can be rinsed and reused. I think both products have good points:)
 
L&M brand of Aspen is dusty..

This stuff makes me sneeze terribly when I'm changing litter in containers. And I've found that the snakes get it in their noses when they burrow as well, which cause some "snorting" from them occasionally.

However, I can't find any other brand of aspen to buy. When I got my snakes from Kathy Love, she had some nice aspen in the deli-cups with my snakes. Soft and dustless, they were like shavings, curly and thin.

This L&M aspen is like overgrown splinters, and I found out that I couldn't let my snakes breed on it. As when my male would finish up and drag his hemipenes across the floor, and then the hemipenis would retract, it would take pieces of litter along with it. Let me tell you, trying to get sticks out of an irritated snake's cloaca in breeding mode is no walk in the park. =P

Anyone know of a better brand of aspen?
 
All of the research I have done has said that Aspen is a non-aromatic type of pine tree. Does anyone else have more information on this?

pinatamonkey said:
Aspen is not a type of pine. It is a poplar.
 
Well, the picture of the aspen leaf should be enough to say it's not a pine (pines have needles, not leaves)

aspen.jpg

Here's a whole aspen tree.

I did a search and found one pet site selling aspen that called it 'aspen pine', but unless aspen shavings aren't actually made of aspen,it isn't pine. I also saw a couple artificial christmas tree stores selling 'aspen pines', but did not find any -real- trees called an aspen pine.

If you look up aspen on dictionary.com, all of the 'tree' definitions will call it a poplar. And a poplar is a deciduous tree, not an evergreen.

So, to conclude, I think 'aspen pine' is a common mistake, but an aspen is not a pine.
 
Re: L&M brand of Aspen is dusty..

Taceas said:
This stuff makes me sneeze terribly when I'm changing litter in containers. And I've found that the snakes get it in their noses when they burrow as well, which cause some "snorting" from them occasionally.

However, I can't find any other brand of aspen to buy. When I got my snakes from Kathy Love, she had some nice aspen in the deli-cups with my snakes. Soft and dustless, they were like shavings, curly and thin.

This L&M aspen is like overgrown splinters, and I found out that I couldn't let my snakes breed on it. As when my male would finish up and drag his hemipenes across the floor, and then the hemipenis would retract, it would take pieces of litter along with it. Let me tell you, trying to get sticks out of an irritated snake's cloaca in breeding mode is no walk in the park. =P

Anyone know of a better brand of aspen?

I use the AlfaPet brand and I get it at WalMart. I just looked at all the packages that I have and none have any dust settled at the bottom. It is fine in texture, soft and fluffly. I have also used the K-Tee brand and it's ok, more expensive though.
 
CornCrazy said:
All of the research I have done has said that Aspen is a non-aromatic type of pine tree. Does anyone else have more information on this?

Name: Populas tremuloides
Populas, from the Latin poplar
tremuloides, from the Latin, tremulus
(shaking, trembling, quivering) from the movement of the leaves in the wind.

Taxonomy: Family Salicaceae, the Willows, with aspen and poplars. Genus Populas the Poplars

Just some usless info, unless your a tree lover like me:D I won't type in any more for fear of putting everyone to sleep;)

Another bit of usless info is that Aspens are hardwoods and Pines are not.
 
LLLREPTILE is a good company to deal with...

Long post...as usual ;)
LLLREPTILE delivers the goods as advertised.
I have "met" the owner at a show and watched and listen as he fielded various questions... he seemed very knowledgeable, across the board, about reptile care in general ( i.e. Lizards, snakes, tortoises...).
I ordered some Bearded dragons online from "triple L" back in the spring of '99, and recieved very nice, beautifully colored red/ gold phase dragons.
I have ordered various care items from them since then, and always had a very good online ordering experience with them.
Triple L is definitely a company to be emulated by others in the Reptile supply business. They deserve continued success and have earned their very positive reputation in the reptile industry. imho.

I suspect, "Habi-chips" are nothing more or less than "Sani-Chips" re-packed inhouse by LLLREPTILE into smaller, user friendly portions from the 4 cubic foot bag of Sani Chips.

The product is widely advertised as "Safe for snakes, lizards, and many others.
Uniform, heat-treated hard-wood chips are extremely safe & sanitary.
Used by zoos and breeders for decades, Hardwood Chips have a proven track record for safety and ease of use."

The following is from the manufacturers website regarding the method / procedures involved in manufacture of a sanitized hard wood chip product such as this. Much more involved of a procedure than I would have guessed.

"SANI-CHIPS®
Unparalleled Quality Control

Rest assured that we make every effort possible to supply our customers with quality products free of bacteria and other contaminants.

We begin the production of Sani-Chips®by using select hardwood logs that are debarked (bark is nature's guard against bacteria and disease) before they are sawn at sawmills.
This special debarking process ensures the purity of our product.
These mills also remove large pieces before loading our closed van trailers via air conveying systems.

Our trailers only haul hardwood, guaranteeing no contamination from softwoods containing tars and resins.

Once the sawmills ship our raw material, the employees at our production facility unload it with front end loaders, depositing the material directly into an enclosed hopper.
The wood is removed from the hopper via a metered, precision ground auger to our initial screeners, which eliminate all coarse particles according to customer specifications.
At this point our system is completely closed.

After the initial screening, all desired particles are dropped through a rotary air lock into a 3 phase, 75 ft. pass, where they are rotary drum dried, with a maximum temperature of 1200F., for 20 minutes.
This reduces the moisture content to 8%, with a +/- 2% variance and kills most harmful bacteria.

We then convey the product, by air, from the dryer to another set of sifters, screening to a final particle size, as per the customer's specifications.

To further refine our product, we have added additional, innovative and unique equipment, enabling us to further increase our screening and aspirating efficiencies."
http://www.pjmurphy.net/sanichips/qualitycontrol.htm
Now available in the new "irradiated" version to research labs.
:)

I personally use newspaper and paper towels for substrate.
A great way to recycle newspaper.
As cheap (affordable) as it gets.

Corn cob bedding (manufactured for use with birds) should not be used as a substrate because it can cause excessive drying of dermal tissues* and many times Corn Cob bedding can cause serious intestinal blockage if swallowed (it expands when wet).
imho. :)


The ol' air conditioner is working overtime which also further dehumidifies the air.

Open water dishes and "moist hides" in enclosures tend to compensate for the very low ambient natural humidity levels we experience this time of year.
 
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I sent a message to LLL re: the inappropriateness of pine chips, and I had someone else reply back that the first person had been incorrect in their reply and that their sani chips were in fact aspen and would be fine for the corns.
So I thank everyone for their responses, it does appear that LLL keeps their reputation.
Tina

ps I saw the eggs that are holidng our new babies this weekend, we're only a couplke of weeks away to seeing them and a couple more to get them, very excited, I tease myself by looking at the photo galley hatchlings.
 
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