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supride in a clutch, did anybody have an idea???

mactopa

mactopa

cornsnake-farmer
breeding :
Caramel het. Bloodred Striped poss. het. Amel (Auratum Linie) x Butter het. Bloodred Striped (Auratum Linie)

I can`t understand this result did anybody have an idea?
I breeded this corns and the result is:

1 x normal
2 x looks like anery (caramel)
3 x caramel
1 x looks like anery blood
1 x carablood
2 x caramel blood striped
1 x looks like anery blood striped

normal


one of thos corns which looks like anery???



caramel


one corn which looks like aneryblood???

 
carablood



two x carablood striped



and one corn which looks like aneryblood striped???





first of all:
no confusion between the clutches!!!
no sperm storage it was the first breedig for her!!!
 
Your adults are both het for anery, which is dominant over caramel. and either one adult isn't a caramel or you have a case of retained sperm. Also, IMO, all the hatchlings you have posted as being caramel/caramel bloodred, don't look like a caramel hatchlings to me. They all have way too much red and look like normals/normal stripes/normal bloodreds.
 
I guess your Caramel is probably not het amel, and both parents _are_ at least het anery?? That anery or anery blood stripe is AMAZING!!!

Male = Caramel, het. Anery, het Bloodred, het. Stripe
Female = Amelanistic, Caramel, Stripe, het. Anery, het Bloodred

Offspring predicted as:

---------------------------------------------------
9/32 Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
9/32 Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Anerythristic, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Anerythristic, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Bloodred, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic)
3/32 Bloodred, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic)
1/32 Anerythristic, Bloodred, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe)
1/32 Anerythristic, Bloodred, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic)

(posted after Susan's caramel remarks- I assumed that the caramel parent was FOR SURE caramel)
 
Susan said:
Your adults are both het for anery, which is dominant over caramel. and either one adult isn't a caramel or you have a case of retained sperm. Also, IMO, all the hatchlings you have posted as being caramel/caramel bloodred, don't look like a caramel hatchlings to me. They all have way too much red and look like normals/normal stripes/normal bloodreds.
Click to expand...

thanks that is a good idea, but the problen is the parents are hom caramel.

the father is from Caramel Blood Red het. Amel x Caramel Striped het. Amel ( Auratum Linie ) clutch



the mother is from Caramel Striped het.Amel( Auratum Linie ) x Caramel Blood Red het. Amel clutch



and retained sperm is not possible, it is her first breeding she ist from 2008!!!

Nanci said:
I guess your Caramel is probably not het amel, and both parents _are_ at least het anery?? That anery or anery blood stripe is AMAZING!!!

Male = Caramel, het. Anery, het Bloodred, het. Stripe
Female = Amelanistic, Caramel, Stripe, het. Anery, het Bloodred

Offspring predicted as:

---------------------------------------------------
9/32 Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
9/32 Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Anerythristic, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Anerythristic, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Bloodred)
3/32 Bloodred, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic)
3/32 Bloodred, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic, 66% poss. het. Anerythristic)
1/32 Anerythristic, Bloodred, Caramel (het. Amelanistic, het. Stripe)
1/32 Anerythristic, Bloodred, Caramel, Stripe (het. Amelanistic)

(posted after Susan's caramel remarks- I assumed that the caramel parent was FOR SURE caramel)
Click to expand...

also thanks and yes that was my first idea, but then came out the normal
 
Well, I just skated past the normal, I guess. One of the parents has to not be homo caramel, then. But I'd _expect_ to see more than one normal, in that case. Hmmm. According to your pedigree, the parents have to be homo caramal. It's an enigma.
 
Gorgeous babies!!

The ones with normal patterns and clear bellies are definately bloodreds.
The ones with striped patterns may or may not be bloodreds, they will have to be tested in the future to know for sure. Neither parent was a homo bloodred, so any stripes resulting has only a 1 in 4 chance of being a bloodred.

edited to add, that anery striped is just amazing!
 
Neither of the parents are homo caramel. The father isn't a caramel, and the mother isn't a butter. That's how you got normals in the clutch.
 
Woops I just noticed the picture of the 'butter'. That doesnt look like a butter to me that looks like an amel.

I am thinking she must be an amel het caramel, anery, bloodred, stripe, explaining why the whole clutch wasn't caramels. And since you got no amels then the 'caramel' most probably isnt het amel.

Still, the caramel is still an unusual one, and probably came from the same breeder as the OP's.
 
Blue Apple Herps said:
Neither of the parents are homo caramel. The father isn't a caramel, and the mother isn't a butter. That's how you got normals in the clutch.
Click to expand...

airenlow said:
That's what I was thinking. Looks like a Normal and an Amel to me...
Click to expand...

Now that we see the parents, there is no doubt that you have been mislead and do not have caramels. The father is a normal bloodred and the mother is an amel. They may not even be het caramel as I have yet to see a caramel hatchling being posted. Sorry.

These might help:

Caramel Bloodred plus at Ian's Vivarium

Butter plus at Ian's Vivarium
 
thanks for all, but I know how looks like caramel and butter.
the problem is that caramel and butter in the auratum line don`t look normal.

ok we assume
the male is a normal het. anery bloodred caramel strped and
the female an amel het. anery bloodred caramel strped.

then the result would be:

27 / 256 Stripe het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Diffused, Caramel
27 / 256 Caramel het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Diffused, Stripe
27 / 256 Diffused het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Stripe, Caramel
27 / 256 Anery het Amel 66% poss het. Diffused, Stripe, Caramel
81 / 256 Normal het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Diffused, Stripe, Caramel
9 / 256 Caramel, Stripe het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Diffused
9 / 256 Diffused, Stripe het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Caramel
9 / 256 Anery, Stripe het Amel 66% poss het. Diffused, Caramel
9 / 256 Granite ( Anery, Diffused ) het Amel 66% poss het. Stripe, Caramel
9 / 256 Anery Caramel ( Anery, Caramel ) het Amel 66% poss het. Diffused, Stripe
9 / 256 Diffused Caramel ( Caramel, Diffused ) het Amel 66% poss het. Anery, Stripe
3 / 256 Granite, Stripe ( Anery, Diffused, Stripe ) het Amel 66% poss het. Caramel
3 / 256 Anery Caramel, Stripe ( Anery, Caramel, Stripe ) het Amel 66% poss het. Diffused
3 / 256 Diffused Caramel, Stripe ( Caramel, Diffused, Stripe ) het Amel 66% poss het. Anery
3 / 256 Anery Caramel, Diffused ( Anery, Caramel, Diffused ) het Amel 66% poss het. Stripe
1 / 256 Anery Caramel, Diffused, Stripe ( Anery, Caramel, Diffused, Stripe ) het Amel

it is only one normel in the clutch!!!! ;)
and please do not say now had luck :D
 
Sorry, all I can say is that "auratum line caramels" do not look like any other snake I have ever seen that is homozygous caramel, but do look like a multitude of normals, normal bloodreds, normal stripes, normal striped bloods that I have seen.
 
Susan said:
Sorry, all I can say is that "auratum line caramels" do not look like any other snake I have ever seen that is homozygous caramel, but do look like a multitude of normals, normal bloodreds, normal stripes, normal striped bloods that I have seen.
Click to expand...

yes this is true, I hadn`t never saw a "normal caramel" which looks like aratum line caramels.
I didn`t say it is a "normal caramel" line.
I was hoping someone had a good idea away from the gen calculator, because a calculator I can work for my own.
thanks for all posts, I got a good idea by chuck on the source.
who is interested in, then you can watch it there. I can`t share any link it does not work no idea why.
 
In regard to the "Auratum line"...
That Other Site said:
There is a line in europe which contains a phenomenon similar to buf. So far, from what I recall, it looks like it is a dominant gene with a quasi-caramel phenotype.
Click to expand...

Buf?!? On that note...:sidestep:
 
Great- yet another gene to confuse me! At least with Buf and Orange, new terms were coined. The auratum-butter and auratum-caramel terminology is confusing.
 
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