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what should be my share ?

T

Tiras

New member
Hi,
First, I want to apologize because of my grammar.:eek:
Until now I only used my own male & female for breeding.
Now I'm considering using somebody else's male.
My question is if there is any accepted ratio in which the owner of the male and the owner of the female should divide the hatchlings among themselves.
Thanks for your answers.
Mikey.
 
It would depend on the arrangement between the two parties involved.

But ALWAYS ONLY do breeding loans with people you trust. That's the number 1 rule!
 
Generally I do 50/50 breeding loans, but it always depends on what the other person really wants. I'm doing a loan this year where he only wants 1.1 of the offspring plus I offered him 1.1 from the same type of project from another clutch as an extra thank you. It all depends upon preference, what the project is (what the offspring would be worth), who's taking care of the clutch, among other things...
 
Thank you for the tips and answers.
I noticed that females have been sold bit expensive then males, and I thought it has its effect when breeding comes into consideration.
 
As everyone has said, it depends on your arrangement.

My clutch that's about to hatch is sired by my friend's male but she only wants a pair of babies in return, for her personal collection. :)

Next year though I am sending a girl to her male and we are going 50/50 on the clutch, mostly because they will be the first ultramels het lavender motley bred in South Africa. Actually, I think they will be the first ultramels bred in south africa! lol
 
Tiras said:
Hi,
First, I want to apologize because of my grammar.:eek:
Until now I only used my own male & female for breeding.
Now I'm considering using somebody else's male.
My question is if there is any accepted ratio in which the owner of the male and the owner of the female should divide the hatchlings among themselves.
Thanks for your answers.
Mikey.
Click to expand...

Honestley, I think the owner of the female should get more, as they have to care for the eggs and such.
 
patm1313 said:
Honestley, I think the owner of the female should get more, as they have to care for the eggs and such.
Click to expand...

But the owner of the female is only getting the eggs and such to deal with because the owner of the male is willing to let him be used ... without one, you wouldn't have the other.
 
As the others have said, it really does depend on the arrangement between owners. I think that once you do sit down and discuss the 'deal,' it would probably be best to make a paper contract that you both sign so it can be tracked.

Ordinarily I would say that with a female of the same value of the male to be borrowed, and the caretaking of the eggs and gravid female done mainly by its owner, the owner of the female should get....
-First and third choice of keepers
-57-75% profit from the sales of the hatchlings
And the owner of the male should get....
-Second and fourth choice of keepers
-25-43% profit from the sales of the hatchlings
Should either party want more than two keepers, they would have to pay the other party their share of the 'sale.'

So, in this case, say I have a lavender motley het snow female that I want to breed to a friend's lavender motley het amel male. Although one is missing a het, their roughly the same value. I intend to care for the eggs and female through the breeding process. By the end the day (yeah, right), I have 12 eggs that hatch to 2.1 opal motleys ph anery, 4.5 lavender motleys ph snow. Since I took care of the female, I get first choice of keeper and choose the female. The owner of the male (John Doe) decides to take the nicer of the two opal motley males getting second choice. I take the second male, and John takes a lavender motley female. Now we each have a pair. But wait, I fall in love with a little lavender motley female and want some color diversity in my collection. So, John and I set a price to sell the remaining lavender motleys for. He gets 33% of profit. Since I want that female, I give him 33% of her value and I get to keep her. But wait, he really likes a lav mot male, so he gives me 66% of his value and he gets to keep him.
See how this works?
The variables are for you two to decide. Other variables that could shift who 'deserves' what are things like...

-Value difference between specimens
-Whether one snake is being shipped out to another breeder
-Who cares for the eggs, or if there is split labor
-Double clutches
-Whether the female is being bred to another male that year (Sperm can be saved, and the paternity among clutches is mixed up.)
-Egg binding or if one specimen is comprimised somehow during the trade

Everything needs to be taken into consideration- vet bills, labor, hatch count, etc. Again, a paper contract can go a long way, even among friends.

Best of luck.
 
Hi there, the way I do it is as follows. I have a Male Amel and my buddy has a Female Classic Het Amel. He is not interested in getting any more corns.
I have bred my Male to his Female for the last four seasons and we have the following verbal arrangement, I get to pick the first best baby in the clutch and then he picks second best, me third , him fourth and so on until the clutch is evenly divided, if the clutch is of an odd number he gets the extra baby. He sells his babies to whom he wants and what I get from him I sell to who I want.
I score on the deal because he gets to look after the eggs and care for the babies until they have had their first meal but I basically get babies to sell for free above what I have got from my own breeding program, E.G. this year I get to sell my 41 hatchlings plus 11 I got from him.
Sorry for the long post.

Ciao
 
You might also want to factor in that it's the female that will be carrying all the risks associated with egg-laying (principally egg binding). The male just does the deed and takes it easy.

Also, breeding can shorten the life of a female as it's a huge drain on physical resources.
 
Topazfyre said:
As the others have said, it really does depend on the arrangement between owners. I think that once you do sit down and discuss the 'deal,' it would probably be best to make a paper contract that you both sign so it can be tracked.
Click to expand...

Holy crap consoler, by the time the attorneys finish up there will be no profit left to split. I've got a splitting head ache. :smash:
 
With chondro eggs it's usually 50/50 with the person doing the incubating and starting of babies getting the odd baby out. For instance if there's 11 babies, the person who bred, incubated and cared for the babies gets the extra one.
 
Weebonilass said:
If the male is the more valuable animal, why won't many breeders sell a single female or charge you 25% more... :D
Click to expand...

blckkat said:
He meant the more valuable animal in the pairing, brilliant...
As in a Pewter is more valuable then a Charcoal. :bang:
Click to expand...

Yeah...I was talking about a pairing using rarer morphs. If the morphs are common enough to buy males and females then it isn't a big deal and I'd say the breeding loan would be close to a 50/50 split with the owner of the female getting the extra animal and first pick.

But like others have said, it all depends on the pairing. I've got several breeding loans going on and each loan is a little different. Granted, I'm not loaning one of my snows to a guy with amels to get amels het snow so my breedings are a little more complicated and dealing with animals that are not very common on the open market. For example, I've got adult sunkissed, hypo blood, lava, and others out on loan and am working with amber stripes on loan to be used in house. I've also got double het animals out on loan. Those are real tricky....the double het animal loan goal is obviously to produce that homozygous two-gene animal which pulls in on the odds scale of 1 in 16. How many will really be produced? How do you split that? :shrugs: Not an easy split down the middle and to tell you the truth this is the first time I've done a breeding loan with a double het animal and it'll be interesting the outcome of the clutch.

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When I did it, it was my male & his female, but the female stayed with me. I bred them, cared for & fed her, incubated the eggs...

We ended up with 3 amels & the rest normals; I kept a pair of amels & gave him the extra male but ended up with 8 babies total while he ended up with 9.

I agree that in writing is always the best way. You should agree on what to do with double hets that are known to possibly occur but also that may occur. In my situation neither of knew that our animals were het for amel.
 
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