• Hello!

    Either you have not registered on this site yet, or you are registered but have not logged in. In either case, you will not be able to use the full functionality of this site until you have registered, and then logged in after your registration has been approved.

    Registration is FREE, so please register so you can participate instead of remaining a lurker....

    Please be certain that the location field is correctly filled out when you register. All registrations that appear to be bogus will be rejected. Which means that if your location field does NOT match the actual location of your registration IP address, then your registration will be rejected.

    Sorry about the strictness of this requirement, but it is necessary to block spammers and scammers at the door as much as possible.

What would you do? (possible sunkissed/butter/motley etc project)

Silvergrin

New member
So the hatchling season's winding down, and while this year wasn't anything new (anery/amel/snow/normal and creams/striped creams... which are cool but this is my second season with the pair!) the next couple years I hope will have a bit more going on! So I'm just dreaming a bit of what's to come here ^-^ Maybe you can help me plan!

For next season, I hope to breed my het butter motley female with my butter het motley boy. They're big but it'll be the first time for both of them *crosses fingers*

I also have a pair of sunkissed "okees"...
Girl:
okeeF20070311a.jpg

Boy's also hypo:
hypokee20070311.jpg


I've been sort of scratching my head over them. I love the way they look but they're sibs so I'm a bit reluctant to breed them, although they won't be ready for anything till 2009!

Then it hit me... maybe I could try a butter/sunkissed/motley project! ^-^
My general breeding goals are to minimize inbreeding and aquiring new animals (heh, yeah, sort of mutually exclusive...) as well as maximize variety, because that's fun ;D
So, starting with these animals, what might be the best course?

Also, photo request! Pictures of sunkissed and motley/caramel/amber/butter combos, especially adults, would be great! (I did do a forum search, but didn't turn up too much...) Also, are there any special names for sunkissed caramel/amber/butter combos? (For example, I know creamsicle/sunkissed is "suncream", but I don't have any intention of crossing my creams and my corns)

Some thoughts: From my hypothetical butter het mot x het butter mot clutch, hold back (ideally) a boy and girl butter mot. Grow them up, pair with the okees, save a few from each and pair up the okeexbuttermots F1. (they'd be close cousins, but still...) See what the F2 looks like and go from there!
But since I really doubt I'd get so lucky as to have a male and female buttermot ;D (1/16 chance of buttermot per egg, I believe, and then there's the gender...), preferentially save whatever buttermots I get, and then preferentially save caramel mots... yes?

Other possible problems: how hard is it to tell a sunkissed from non-sunkissed? If they were caramel or butter? If they were motley? (not banded; the "hurricane" kind) The distinctive feature for sunkissed young'uns seems to be the funky head pattern; is that considered a defining trait?

Also, when doing such a project, how many animals would you hold back at each step? If you were to get another animal, which would it be and for what pairing?
Step 1: butter het mot x het buttermot => buttermot or caramel mot
Step 2: sunkissed/hyposunkissed x buttermot/caramel mot => F1
Step 3: F1 x F1 => F2 (profit!) ;D
Step ???: ???

I suppose that's enough speculation for now ;D
 
I would cross your butter het mot to the female sunkissed in 09 and hold back 2-3 pairs of het sunkissed amel caramel pos. het motleys. You'll be able to breed the pairs no later than 2012, and the odds you get motley thrown into the mix will be pretty good :*)
 
I'd honestly go a different route with say a lavender or a bloodred paired with the male, but I have to say those sunkisseds are stunning!
 
I wouldn't breed the siblings unless you really want a two headed or two tailed snake. Just a thought that's pretty messed up for the snakes if you think about it.
 
I wouldn't breed the siblings unless you really want a two headed or two tailed snake. Just a thought that's pretty messed up for the snakes if you think about it.

With corns F2's (and F3's and 4's) are bred all the time with no ill effects...
 
Well I wouldn't mind a two-headed snake but that's not very likely ;) As far as I know what genetic components such things have (and if my snakes have it) only make it mildly less impossible :p
Personally I'd be more worried about stargazing and generally reduced vigor/clutch size/etc.

Not a bad idea to breed the sunkissed okee female to the butter het mot male! Maybe I oughta look into picking up an ambermot lady or somesuch this season, too... ;)
 
I'd honestly go a different route with say a lavender or a bloodred paired with the male, but I have to say those sunkisseds are stunning!

Hey sorry didn't see you there Joe!
Any particular reason you'd go with lavender or bloodred?
Thanks, I think they're great too; wasn't planning on getting anything at that show but I couldn't pass 'em up!
 
Is this boy proven to be homo hypo?:eek:
I have to agree they are stunning!!!

The only pics I have seen of the combos you're asking are of hatchlings to yearlings.
Rich Z has a few pics of hatchlings.
Serpwidgets has some progression threads on his webpage.
And maybe you can find some pics of sunkissed combos in Snakesalive's forum threads.

I believe that every sunkissed combo is hot!It's just the last few years that we get to see sunkissed mixed with everything.Only a few are produced (even sunkissed amels) and only a handful are for sale...
I have yet to see a sunkissed bloodred!!
 
:shrugs: Honestly this was a really lucky find on my part: I knew nothing about sunkissed and was simply on the lookout for a pretty "okeetee" (lookeetee!). In 2005 at the MARS reptile show I saw this pair advertised as Female okee het hypo and male hypo okee. I didn't know they were sunkissed until I posted photos here and everyone said they were dead ringers for it! In which case it seems I got an amazing bargain, looking at some of the prices on hypo sunkissed O-o

So, not sure what you mean by the boy being "proven" hypo (he's not been bred yet!) but he certainly looks hypo in comparison with the girl! While the breeders not knowing about the sunkissed may bring some of the genes into question, the show's really top quality so while the breeders may have left some info out I don't think they made anything up!
 
:shrugs: Honestly this was a really lucky find on my part: I knew nothing about sunkissed and was simply on the lookout for a pretty "okeetee" (lookeetee!). In 2005 at the MARS reptile show I saw this pair advertised as Female okee het hypo and male hypo okee. I didn't know they were sunkissed until I posted photos here and everyone said they were dead ringers for it! In which case it seems I got an amazing bargain, looking at some of the prices on hypo sunkissed O-o

So, not sure what you mean by the boy being "proven" hypo (he's not been bred yet!) but he certainly looks hypo in comparison with the girl! While the breeders not knowing about the sunkissed may bring some of the genes into question, the show's really top quality so while the breeders may have left some info out I don't think they made anything up!


I found the other thread and I also agree they are both sunkissed.But given the breeders knowledges about the sunkissed gene I don't think they were refering to hypo A.They messed things a bit.Just my 2 cents.

I really wish he is also homo hypo A.:)
But I wouldn't bet my money on it at least without some breeding trials first.I also have a pair of siblings sunkissed and I can see a color difference between the sexes.I have also seen many sunkissed's pics from various bloodlines and I can find many with that look,not being homo hypo.
I think the only one that can give a more accurate opinion on that subject by just looking that snake is Rich Z.He is the only one I know to have adult hypo sunkisseds.And the rest of us just dream of those....:rofl:
I guess with my question I was expecting an answer about the parents genetics (if you had that),since the snakes are not in breeding size yet.
Thanks for your answer!:)
 
Last edited:
Oh dear this just gets more and more complicated! XD
Afraid I don't know much about their background: they were sold to me as a sibling pair of "okeetees", the female as "het hypo" and the boy as "hypo". The boy looked significantly lighter to me, so I didn't think to question it (and I was mostly going "ooooh, orange!" anyway). I asked about amel and the guy said poss het amel.
I do get info from people I buy snakes from and save it somewhere... I've moved twice since that show though! I'll have to dig around when I get home (well okay, maybe tomorrow, halloween and all!) and see if I can't contact the breeders, although I'm a little dubious that they'll be able to do more than say "2005? I dunno!"
Thanks for letting me know about that! I may look into getting something to prove/disprove hypo. :) Trying to at least wait till I sell this year's hatchlings!
 
Thanks!

I would still be very happy with them if they weren't hypo/het hypo (A), but now I'm curious!

And the more I thought about crossing these guys to lavenders, the more I liked it... perhaps it would make for some super colorful opals! And I've been looking for an excuse to get into lavenders... so I picked up a hypo lavender male and an opal female today :D Not very colorful ones, but maybe in a generation or two ^-^

*pics to come later*
 
Cool!! :)

I think you did the right move!:smash:

Sunkissed lavenders are amazing and I think that sunkissed opals will be equally outstanding!
 
Back
Top