nothing furry
except for food
no hybrid, just corn morphs. Like leucistic, pied. or any unusual morph or pattern variation? I've been thinking about this for a while, so hopefully you guys can help.
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whats the rare'est morph
- Thread starter nothing furry
- Start date
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
The leucistic gene has not shown up in cornsnakes, to my knowledge. Piebald, either, though there is "pied-sided", which is similar. There are also some new genetics that people are currently working on tracing and "figuring out" that are quite different than anything else that is commonly available.
In my experience, it is not to difficult to find any "single recessive" morph, like amel, anery, hypo, diffused...it is only when you get into mutiple recessive homozygous snakes that the availability becomes extremely limited, and even the doubles are becoming more common, like butter, amber, ghost, phantom. The triples are where the money starts getting large...butter stripe comes to mind. I would imagine that a striped ghost would be a nice find, too. Get into the quad-recessives, and you're talking very rare...if for no other reason than the breeding trials take SO long to aquire the homozygous offspring...
Of course, with that being said, I am fairly new to the cornsnake "game", and even more so to the genetics side of things, so I could be completely off-base...
In my experience, it is not to difficult to find any "single recessive" morph, like amel, anery, hypo, diffused...it is only when you get into mutiple recessive homozygous snakes that the availability becomes extremely limited, and even the doubles are becoming more common, like butter, amber, ghost, phantom. The triples are where the money starts getting large...butter stripe comes to mind. I would imagine that a striped ghost would be a nice find, too. Get into the quad-recessives, and you're talking very rare...if for no other reason than the breeding trials take SO long to aquire the homozygous offspring...
Of course, with that being said, I am fairly new to the cornsnake "game", and even more so to the genetics side of things, so I could be completely off-base...
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
Do you think that most of them are either being worked on or being seriously thought about by now? Or are most breeders working on figuring out the current mysteries and/or looking for new genes? In your opinion, of course. By no means do I expect you to be able to speak for anyone other than yourself...Susan said:
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PtDnsr
I like calculus
From what I can tell it goes this way when combining genes: Rich is at least five years ahead of anyone. The other big breeders are probably at least three years ahead of us. Then there's breeders like me (really small) that aren't necessarily behind the times but not doing anything completely new or even very exciting. Then there's the ones just starting out that can play catch up if they want. Keep in mind there are exceptions to that rule and I'm sure there are some middle sized breeders out there that have one line they're particularly working on something that they're ahead. Oh yeah, and all of that is a guesstimate so hope it helped! :grin01:tyflier said:
~Katie
Susan said:
I agree with Susan that the Z morph is currently the most rare, known proven morph (single gene) available on the market. But we all know (or are at least hoping) that Rich probably has a half dozen or more that he is secretly trying to prove out :bowdown: .
If the 'golden corn' proves out, it may be more rare, but I am still waiting to see some updates (I have some doubts about it). But nevertheless, I'll be going herping (in 2 months) in the sandhills/piedmont area where it was found a few years ago to see what else is out there.
I agree with Susan, it's got to be the Cinders unless some other traits prove out like the "Matrix" corn. The last time I checked, my Amel Cinder is the only one in existance, but that's a combo. I'm sure there are plenty of combos out there where only one or two exist, but it's just a matter of time. I'd really like to see a Ghost Lavender Motley (Anery, Lav, Hypo, Motley) or Ghost Lavender Bloodred and I'm sure that if some exist, they have not yet been proven. There are so many possibilities out there, I think we are just touching the surface of the triple, quad, and even quint homos.
Roy Munson
New member
If anyone out there happens to see a lava-sunkissed-lavender-cinder-bloodred pair for sale anywhere, please drop me a PM. 
nothing furry
except for food
by the way all of you are talking, I cant wait to see what emerges.
Another question: HOW ARE THEY PROVEN???
Another question: HOW ARE THEY PROVEN???
Well I meant proven as a heritable trait. So breeding trails would have to take place to make sure it was actually different than other similar morphs (like Cinder had to be tested against Anery and Charcoal), and they also have to prove that it is reproducable. In most cases, we like to prove it's a simple recessive gene. You can prove this by breeding an animal that shows a unique quality to one of it's offspring to see if 50% show that same quality.nothing furry said:
nothing furry
except for food
you'll have to excuse my ignorance, I'm new to the genetics of this:
Can it be proven in a lab, instead of waiting to breed??
Can it be proven in a lab, instead of waiting to breed??
E.Crassus
Note, its only a hobby
New morphs will keep popping up really until either masking takes over.
Time is also a factor, say we had a an motley hypo opal bloodred, thats 5 homos, is 6 possible? lavamel motley bloodred? only 4.
What I think will be a massive step is seeing if Lava (hypo c) has an effect on hypo a.
any ideas?
Time is also a factor, say we had a an motley hypo opal bloodred, thats 5 homos, is 6 possible? lavamel motley bloodred? only 4.
What I think will be a massive step is seeing if Lava (hypo c) has an effect on hypo a.
any ideas?
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
I would think that in order to "prove" anything in a lab setting, the DNA "code" of each gene would first need to be mapped, and than testing could be done on individual snakes to see if they actually possess those genes or just a similar trait. However, that poses a conundrum...first of all it would be incredibly expensive to test and map all known single recessive genes. Second, you would probably be surprised to find out that two snakes from different bloodlines that look extremely similar, *might* have completely different DNA, rather than possessing the same simple recessive gene. I don't KNOW that that is true, but it is a possiblity that would probably prove more frustrating than it would be worth.nothing furry said:
The easiest way to determine the inheritability of any gene is through a breeding trial...which is happening all over.
TandJ
Ole' Stoic Viper...
There are double homo hypo's in existance already.. Search around here on the board and you will see a few of them.. I am sure someone has done one with Lava and another hypo.. Likely Jope Pierce has.. Rich had a heavily suspected Ultramel Sunkissed posted a will back.. I have considered trying the double homo hypo animals just for kicks.. I have in my group Hypo A, Sunkissed, ( I will put money on this one.. >) Ultra, and possibly lava ( breeding trials are need to prove it ).. I am not sure if Dilute might be considered a form of Hypo or not... Eithier way, I could possibly have some serious fun in the future..
Regards.. Tim of T and J
Some Hypos have proved to be cumulative, but that doesn't mean they all will be. As far as I know there is not a proven or suspected Hypo A Lava out there. I know Joe attempted for this with double hets last year but didn't get anything out of the ordinary, just Lavas, Hypos and Normals. Although this doesn't prove they are not cumulative, he may have just had bad luck in getting the double homo. :shrugs:TandJ said:
And speaking of Dilute.... that's another one that's fairly rare.
Jay@PJCReptiles
"Quality Before Quantity"
What about the so called "Strawberry" or "Christmas" genes? Are these traits being worked on or have they already been disproven? :shrugs:
Jay
Jay
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
I thought the "christmas gene" was a combination? I'm probably wrong...PJCReptiles said:What about the so called "Strawberry" or "Christmas" genes? Are these traits being worked on or have they already been disproven? :shrugs:
Jay
I'm very curious to see what is going to come out of the confetti-like genes being found in certain snow morphs, where they have a random dappling of red pigment. Those look really interesting, if they can ever isolate and remove the fatal aspects of it...