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Laminating FlexWatt?

I believe the ones you are referring to TME is Ultratherm heat pads. Also available at the Beanfarm in various widths and lengths. The product description mentions it is the same technology as FlexWatt
 
Jadie.Glitch said:
TME so you say that the combination of Flexwatt and wood is bad? I have a custom cage made out of wood that I was going to use the Flexwatt on so can you give me some more information on this? I work all day and I really don't want my babies to get burned (let along my whole house :sidestep:).

Also, the instructions that I got told me that after I make the heating pad it will be placed at the bottom of the cage directly under the substrate. What do you think about this?
Click to expand...

I will not personally ever use FlexWatt and wood again (I'm sure the pictures speak for themselves). As I said in the other thread; the problem happened 2-4 years (I think more in the 3-4 range because they were built before I bought my house) after the cages were built and in use, their was nothing wrong with the wiring (no bumping/dislodging) and the thermostat was a Helix (and is still in use because their's nothing wrong with it). Cypress mulch was used as a substrate if that matters at all. Their were 3 cages, 2 did this. The FlexWatt was purchased at the same time from the same place.

If you are using the FlexWatt inside the cage, you're going to need something to make it waterproof so spilled bowls don't short it out. As I said earlier in this thread, I know some have been successful putting plexi/acrylic down over the FlexWatt and then sealing around the edges.

cageburn-1.jpg


cageburn-2.jpg
 
Wow, that is super scary :eek:!... Your snakes weren't harmed were they?

That's a great idea about putting something over it and then sealing the edges... I will probably lay a piece of glass or Plexiglas down and the seal it up.

I'm pondering though: What about those "stick-on" linoleum tiles? Could those be placed over the top of the flexwatt??
 
Jadie.Glitch said:
Your snakes weren't harmed were they?
Click to expand...

Thankfully, no. I don't know how, but they weren't. Their were ball pythons in them, so maybe they faired better because they can tolerate a bit higher temps then Cornsnakes?

Jadie.Glitch said:
I'm pondering though: What about those "stick-on" linoleum tiles? Could those be placed over the top of the flexwatt??
Click to expand...

I would be afraid of the heat not letting the glue stay set. It might be something to experiment with using a scrap piece of wood, a piece of FlexWatt and one of those tiles (I know you can buy just 1 tile at Lowes/HomeDepot for testing purposes). Rather then the linoleum tiles, you can also just use the regular rolled linoleum and tack the sides down rather then using glue (you would need to install the linoleum to the bottom before you put the cage together)...But again, I would experiment to make sure it doesn't do anything odd with the FlexWatt.
 
I think it's perfectly valid to caution in the use of Flexwatt; TME didn't say NOT to use it, just to be careful!

I don't see the point in laminating either. I like the idea of a thin sheet of metal though; someone mentioned they did that, where do you get the metal? I'm thinking something a little like tinfoil, only more substantial/resistant to tearing, but still fairly easy to cut. I'm sure such things exist, just don't know how to get at them?
 
Yeah, I just might do that ^_^. I can't wait until I finally have my snake room set up properly. I'll be posting pictures as soon as I'm finished ^_^.
 
Silvergrin said:
I think it's perfectly valid to caution in the use of Flexwatt; TME didn't say NOT to use it, just to be careful!

I don't see the point in laminating either. I like the idea of a thin sheet of metal though; someone mentioned they did that, where do you get the metal? I'm thinking something a little like tinfoil, only more substantial/resistant to tearing, but still fairly easy to cut. I'm sure such things exist, just don't know how to get at them?
Click to expand...

Hmm, not sure where you would get that... the only thing I would be afraid of with the metal as opposed to a piece of plexiglas or something would be that metal retains heat and may even amplify a problem if the flexwatt or thermostat malfunctioned... maybe the other things would do the same... not sure...

Maybe we should just petition and convince our snakes to become warm-blooded so we don't have to worry about this so much! :laugh:
 
Jadie.Glitch said:
Hmm, not sure where you would get that... the only thing I would be afraid of with the metal as opposed to a piece of plexiglas or something would be that metal retains heat and may even amplify a problem if the flexwatt or thermostat malfunctioned... maybe the other things would do the same... not sure...

Maybe we should just petition and convince our snakes to become warm-blooded so we don't have to worry about this so much! :laugh:
Click to expand...

No, I think something with good thermal conductivity should DECREASE the likelihood of a problem. This is because your thermostat probe will be on top of the pad (the temp of the herp's warmspot is the important part) so with good thermal conductivity the 'watt won't be that much warmer than what the probe is sensing. If you have the 'watt insulated, it has to get a lot hotter before the probe senses the temperature difference, and any heat spikes will be sensed (and thus regulated) much more slowly.
 
Wow, thanks... that actually makes a lot of sense... so if I am understanding correctly:

By having to flex-watt MORE insulated (like with wood or tile), it can actually get hotter (and possibly burn the "insulation"/cage/and then next, the snake) before the thermostat senses this heat spike and adjust itself.

But if it is covered with something with good conductivity (like a piece of thin metal), the heat doesn't have to spike much for the thermostat to be like "Whoa, lets drop the temperature" and therefore the thermostat can keep a more constant and SAFE temperature...

Okay, I think I get it now... thanks all!! :dancer:

I feel silly needing to be instructed so carefully, but I would rather feel silly and dumb then to have my snakie get hurt because I was too proud to get educated ^_^.
 
Linoleum is made from linseed oil and wood flour or cork flour. I don't know their flash point but they are flammable, particularly the linseed oil. Oil alone has a flash point around 165 C. to 260 C. depending on oxygen levels and linoleum will likely start to smolder at slightly lower temps. Maybe a thin ceramic floor tile instead?
:realhot:
 
The best thing to use is Aluminum Foil tape which the Bean Farm sells along with the Flex Watt. It is very thin and easy to use. Sticks very well and conducts the heat quickly.
 
Yes metal is a great conductor, heat sinks are made of aluminum or copper and wick the heat away from hot CPUs for example. Metal also conducts electricity well, so you want to be sure your wiring doesn't make contact with the plate and is securely wrapped with a tape that can take high temps.
 
Well, as it stands, our cages have wood floors with the stick-on linoleum pieces on top. What if the layering was this: "wood, linoleum pieces, flex-watt, thin piece of metal, substrate"? Considering the flex-watt would be ON TOP of the linoleum on not under it where the flammable glue is would this work?

The only reason I was wanting to try to keep the linoleum is because my parents spent alot of time building this cage and they were especially proud of how the bottom looked with the linoleum pieces... although when it comes to the safety of my snakes it looks like I am going to just have to tell them to "suck it up 'cause I'm rippin' it out!", lolz...

OORR... I guess I could just not tell them about it 'cause it's always covered in substrate anyways... They probably won't even notice now that I think about it... So, how about "wood, thin piece of metal, flex-watt, thin piece of metal, substrate"?
 
Keep in mind that my problem with FlexWatt had nothing to do with the faulty wiring or thermostat. It is unknown why two pieces, wired separately, essentially caught fire in the middle of the product.

I'm curious how one would waterproof a metal cover or aluminum foil tape? I understand its application on a rack, but not inside a cage where water spillage could cause a problem with the FlexWatt.

Stevieray said:
Linoleum is made from linseed oil and wood flour or cork flour. I don't know their flash point but they are flammable, particularly the linseed oil. Oil alone has a flash point around 165 C. to 260 C. depending on oxygen levels and linoleum will likely start to smolder at slightly lower temps.
Click to expand...

Well, I guess there's the answer on the linoleum issue. :)
I know BD people use linoleum, but they don't use under tank heating at all, but rather overhead spot light heating.
 
The linoleum will make it easy to clean. You want to keep that. The flammable glue is not so flammable once the solvents have evaporated and the glue has dried.

Putting the flex watt on top of the linoleum with aluminum foil tape on to of that would be just great. Then bury it all in aspen shavings.

Remember Flexwatt is designed to not go over 110* max. With a thermostat, it won't be over 85*. This is warm not hot. You put you hand on it and wonder if it is working. We don't have any open flames or arcing wires.

It is possible for the insulation on the power cord to you computer to be faulty and short out. It could happen. It probably won't. Nobody is avoiding their computers for fear of fire. Caution is a good thing. Educating yourself is good as well. Worrying weather the sun will come up tomorrow is probably wasted energy.
 
If Flexwatt only reaches 110 F. maximum (didn't know that) then your linoleum may be safe provided there are no hot spots, such as the connections. If you want to create a barrier between the heater and the linoleum just to be safe: vermiculite, perlite or even a piece of drywall. They also make paperless drywall if paper is a concern. A good place for aluminium tape (lots of uses) is the heating and cooling supply.
 
Stevieray said:
If Flexwatt only reaches 110 F. maximum (didn't know that)
Click to expand...

That's not what Wade said. He said it isn't designed to go over 110F...Not that it can't.

Tom clocked his faulty FlexWatt at 160F and I remember clocking mine at around that as well when I discovered the short/fire/whatever.
 
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