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Any Ideas???

L

Lavman breeder

New member
Ok, Here is my scenario. My first batch of eggs started hatching today from my female butter motley that was bred to two male butter motleys. I do not know of any hets. I did not put this female with any other males aside from these two nice looking male Butter motleys. Out of 17 eggs, 7 of them have the nose/heads out and to my astonishment, one of them is brownish with dark brown eyes!!?? How is this physically possible? I've had the female for 2 years and did not even breed her last year. This year she was ONLY with two male butters. I wouldn't have been suprised to see a snow or even an amel perhaps, but a normal???

thx,

Mike
 
I am still learning about morphs but maybe posting a pic would help others.
 
... One of your butters aint no butter :uhoh:

If the eye is dark then there certainly isn't any Amel, which means you may actually have a golddust, honey, amber, etc instead of a butter.

(Note: it should be a caramel at the least, instead of normal, I would think)
 
I'll post pictures in an hour. I've been breeding corns for years and the adults involved were all Amel Carmels with red eyes aka BUTTERS. I know it seems weird and impossible... The only thing that could have happened is if I made a mistake that I can't remember and put another male in with her. But I wouldn't have let that happen. Pics coming within an hour.

Mike
 
I'll post pictures in an hour. I've been breeding corns for years and the adults involved were all Amel Carmels with red eyes aka BUTTERS. I know it seems weird and impossible... The only thing that could have happened is if I made a mistake that I can't remember and put another male in with her. But I wouldn't have let that happen. Pics coming within an hour.

Mike
 
I've never hatched a caramel but it looks like a Caramel Motley to me? He was the first one out:) Here are a few pics of the pips and the parents.
DSC00295.jpg
 
I'm telling you guys. Even if one of my other males had somehow impregnated her, this could not have happened. This is really really weird! Can anyone shed some light on this? Here are pics of the parents:

Here is the mother..

DSC00197.jpg


Here is the expected father that I bred her to first. You can't see it but his eyes are pinkish red.

DSC00152.jpg


Here is the other possible father who also has red eyes and is a butter. He is the one in the back..

DSC00213.jpg
 
Can you post a pic of the potential males eyes from a slight angle? Maybe it is me, but in pic 2 of the adults, that males eyes look a bit darker than red. I am wondering if it is an ultra caramel? Probably not, but it is a thought.

Any pics of the rest of the clutch would be appreciated.

dc
 
Camby said:
Can you post a pic of the potential males eyes from a slight angle? Maybe it is me, but in pic 2 of the adults, that males eyes look a bit darker than red. I am wondering if it is an ultra caramel? Probably not, but it is a thought.

Any pics of the rest of the clutch would be appreciated.

dc
Click to expand...

BTW, still wouldn't explain the results, IF the snake had an Ultra as a mate, the babies should be ultramels
 
Maybe its a dark hypo? Would that work out if the one of them was homo hypo and another het hypo? I've lost my corn progeny predictor, so I can't plug in the possibilities.
 
dionythicus said:
Maybe its a dark hypo? Would that work out if the one of them was homo hypo and another het hypo? I've lost my corn progeny predictor, so I can't plug in the possibilities.
Click to expand...

It technically shouldn't matter- if both parents are Homo for Amel, the pupils should ALWAYS be red.
Somehow, something other than Amelanism is working here.
 
I don't have any more pictures of any of the adults and they were sold so I can't take new pictures. I agree that the eyes seem darker but in reality, they were pinkish red, just like the others. As of now, All but two of the pips have hatched and they are all butters but the one. I think this may just be one of those unexplainable genetic results.
 
Lavman breeder said:
I don't have any more pictures of any of the adults and they were sold so I can't take new pictures. I agree that the eyes seem darker but in reality, they were pinkish red, just like the others. As of now, All but two of the pips have hatched and they are all butters but the one. I think this may just be one of those unexplainable genetic results.
Click to expand...

The thing that is exciting about it though, is that the 'unexplainable' is always explainable. IF for some reason, that baby DID come from one of those fathers (and no chance of retained sperm or accidental breeding to another male) than you've technically got a gold mine there for another gene that, one way or another, can interact with the Amel gene.
 
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