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Feeding live to F/T babies ??

I breed my own feeders and ALL my snakes eat f/t. I treat my mice as pets and when it's their time to become food they are treated with respect and euthinized humanely.
This post will always show up on forums and it will always be a fight.
The best route is to do what you feel is best for your pets. That being said there is so much evidence that rodents will fight for their lives and snakes have died as a results of this. I personally do not want to risk an injury to one of my pets and I would rather my feeders be put down then have to fight for their lives. So in my opinion if you wish to risk the slight chance that your pet will be harmed and/or killed then go ahead and feed live.

Like you should see how much work research that has gone into slaughter houses to make sure our meat is killed humanely. Stressed beef makes some tough meat, relaxed, calm cows make nice tender meat.
 
ZoologyGirl said:
That would be cool. One of my professors from a few years ago (Patricia McConnell) is friends with Temple Grandin, I never seen her in person though. But I learned about her through that professor.
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My oldest son is Autistic, I own the movie "Temple Grandin" that woman and her mother are heros! Temple uses her autisim to get inside the head of an animal and today thanks to her work slaughter houses and feed lots are much safer places for live stock.
 
If you ever have the chance to talk to Temple, I recommend it. She is really a unique person.

They say that autistic people have a harder time connecting with others or feeling empathy.

I think that Temple is an example why this is WRONG.

Temple feels empathy toward animals to an extent that most of us don't feel empathy toward humans.

She is a great example of humanity at its purist.

Those who would willingly cause a living being to suffer should look to her as an example of why they are wrong.

There is a humane way and a non-humane way to do things.

You have the freedom to choose what way you want.

Our country gives you the freedom to choose either way... but don't expect people to not voice their opinions.

I would rather give a mouse/rat a calm death.
If you choose otherwise, I will judge you- I can't do otherwise. You have the choice and you chose to cause pain.
I don't care what reason you supply.
My snakes are healthy and as happy as a snake can be... and I choose to euthanize mice/rats humanely as much as it is possible (barring snakes that will ONLY eat live and are losing weight/starving as a result).

So, there it is.

Tell me that your snakes prefer live... I think that it is YOU that prefers live... because my corn snakes have not shown preference (barring some new hatchlings that will be converted to f/t before being sold). (And I find this a completely involuntary instinctual drive that is overcome).

So there it is... if your snakes willingly take f/t or freshly killed, then why wouldn't you do the safer, more humane thing?

The only reason I can think is for your own enjoyment.
 
Y'all still can't convince me. Sounds like you are looking for the most sterilized possible way to do things, but what you don't get is demonizing people who feed live and wishing misfortune on their families is an unbalanced response. Crusading your idea of "humaneness" by disparaging fellow snake owners, telling them to go see a shrink, is offensive.

Euthanizing sick people and sick animals is one thing.

Euthanizing a healthy, living creature is murder no matter how you slice it.
At least to according to the PETA (I despise PETA as much as anyone) videos I've seen, slaughterhouses are the last places you'll find humane treatment of animals. Stop pretending already that we humans are capable of humanity towards animals. Sadly what we are capable of, but fail at endlessly, is acting humane towards one another. Which means respecting a persons' decision what to do with their pet instead of lambasting them based on YOUR morality and YOUR sentiments.
Its okay to admit that humans are murderers of lesser forms of being, because we are! We have been making animals suffer for millennia and to think that now we've developed the technology to kill in a kind, justified way, and glorifying painless euthaniza, is disturbing (putting a crippled creature out of its misery is something entirely different). You accuse me of not caring about a mouse's suffering. Whether through conditioning or nature, I'm incapable of feeling for a mouse. I'm busy caring for my fellow humans and for dogs.
How sterilized can people get!
What if people started applying this logic to humans? The world is overpopulated, hey lets give them painless deaths, they won't mind. (I know that sounds silly, but just as silly as you comparing a mouse's suffering to a human's)

The organization I work for, a Dog Hotel, is strongly against euthanizing of any kind. Killing for convenience is not humane, it is a necessity.

And that's what animals are concerned with, necessity. All the sentimentality we impose on them should be directed towards fellow humans we can help, and not rodents.
 
A dog hotel that would rather an animal suffer horribly from cancer.

You work at a crappy "animal" place.

Never come into the hospital where I work.
 
Shiari said:
A dog hotel that would rather an animal suffer horribly from cancer.

You work at a crappy "animal" place.

Never come into the hospital where I work.
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That is not what I said. I meant pointless euthanizing of an animal that ISN'T sick. Killing 'em for the BS excuse of "overpopulation".

You're so quick to judge.
 
I sorry I don't agree with your opinions and I sence that trying would be fruitless and just beating a dead horse after reading your post.

I wish you luck and happness with your snakes.
 
Lennycorn said:
I sorry I don't agree with your opinions and I sence that trying would be fruitless and just beating a dead horse after reading your post.

I wish you luck and happness with your snakes.
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And thats it. Is it just me or is this thread done? Lock it and let it drift away until someone else brings it back up :)
 
Lennycorn said:
I sorry I don't agree with your opinions and I sence that trying would be fruitless and just beating a dead horse after reading your post.

I wish you luck and happness with your snakes.
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Then I'm not gonna visit this forum anymore, because the "humane clique" here gets so offended every time I speak my mind and encourage a rational discussion, coming back at me with biased, emotional, repetitive responses. I get no pleasure out of this. I'm tired of the "humane clique". I hope you guys make good in this world, like you claim to.
 
Euthanisation:

Eu- "good"
Thanatos- "death"

When I put an animal to sleep, no matter the cause, I am euthanising it.

I euthanised the kitten with blood of a pale strawberry milkshake color. We were trying to transfuse it, because it was anemic. But the blood that we drew to make sure we were in the vein was so milky colored that we immediately gave it euthasol instead.

I was there for euthanising the puppy whose skull was in 4 or 5 pieces and who was screaming in agony.

I euthanised the two kittens with pneumonia that were dying in my hands.

I witnessed the euthanasia of a cat with NO FACE because of cancer.

I have had personal pets euthanised, because of cancers.

And euthasol is a concentrated anesthetic. It shuts down the brain, higher function first so the animal falls asleep, and then the brain entirely stops working and the heart stops. Clinical death.

So why the hell SHOULDN'T I provide a mouse with a peaceful death? WHY should I let it die in agony if it doesn't have to?

That YOU cannot have empathy for a living creature, even as you take its life, is wrong. I rescue rolly pollys from sidewalks, and worms from puddles. I take on hard-luck cases that may not survive (neurologic hummingbird, tortured turtle, rat pup caught by cat, hydrocephalic puppy).

How can you have empathy for a reptile that does not show affection, but have no empathy for a rodent that can form social attachments?
 
7legion77 said:
Y'all still can't convince me. Sounds like you are looking for the most sterilized possible way to do things, but what you don't get is demonizing people who feed live and wishing misfortune on their families is an unbalanced response. Crusading your idea of "humaneness" by disparaging fellow snake owners, telling them to go see a shrink, is offensive.

Euthanizing sick people and sick animals is one thing.

Euthanizing a healthy, living creature is murder no matter how you slice it.

Its okay to admit that humans are murderers of lesser forms of being, because we are! We have been making animals suffer for millennia and to think that now we've developed the technology to kill in a kind, justified way, and glorifying painless euthaniza, is disturbing (putting a crippled creature out of its misery is something entirely different). You accuse me of not caring about a mouse's suffering. Whether through conditioning or nature, I'm incapable of feeling for a mouse. I'm busy caring for my fellow humans and for dogs.
How sterilized can people get!
What if people started applying this logic to humans? The world is overpopulated, hey lets give them painless deaths, they won't mind. (I know that sounds silly, but just as silly as you comparing a mouse's suffering to a human's)

The organization I work for, a Dog Hotel, is strongly against euthanizing of any kind. Killing for convenience is not humane, it is a necessity.

And that's what animals are concerned with, necessity. All the sentimentality we impose on them should be directed towards fellow humans we can help, and not rodents.
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Do you feed live food to the dogs too? I knew a kid in high school that ate a live goldfish.

7legion77 said:
im feeling like a ron paul here.
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you must be really hungry
 
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7legion77 said:
Then I'm not gonna visit this forum anymore, because the "humane clique" here gets so offended every time I speak my mind and encourage a rational discussion, coming back at me with biased, emotional, repetitive responses. I get no pleasure out of this. I'm tired of the "humane clique". I hope you guys make good in this world, like you claim to.
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Well sorry if you want to take your ball and leave but I don't think it's possable to have a rational discussion with you either. I mean, your side of the discussion seem biased and emotional too.

As you say..."I hope you guys make good in this world"
Well I hope you don't eat meat that was culled in slaughterhouses cause then you would be going against your rationality.
 
7legion77 said:
And let me add, it's probably the "disturbed" types, who one day suddenly watched a hamster kill their boa, who are the biggest proponents AGAINST live feeding.
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7legion77 said:
Then I'm not gonna visit this forum anymore, because the "humane clique" here gets so offended every time I speak my mind and encourage a rational discussion, coming back at me with biased, emotional, repetitive responses. I get no pleasure out of this. I'm tired of the "humane clique". I hope you guys make good in this world, like you claim to.
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I'm not sure how you justify calling ME and many of my friends "disturbed" as contributing to "a rational discussion". Honestly, I don't think you understand what the word "humane" means, but at this point I don't even care. If you choose to feed live I am not going to argue with you, that is your choice and you have your reasons for it whether I agree with them or not. There is no way I or anyone else on this forum can stop you from feeding live (which is why I don't get why you care SO MUCH what we all think anyway). I couldn't care less whether you don't agree with me feeding F/T. But after you offhandedly proposed I may be "disturbed" I lost any respect for you. If you never return to this forum again I won't shed any tears. Have a nice life, good bye.
 
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