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Genetics... What defines "domestication"?

Rainkeltoia, I'm sort of doing that now. The biggest problem with such an endeavor is that behavior isn't measurable.
 
Well, technically the corn snake is considered second gen. domesticated. Because there are traits that require human intervention to perpetuate their survival ie: bright colors, scaleless ect.

Of course they dont have TRUE domestication where they become tools for human tasks, like dogs, cattle ect. have become. Though I don't see why they couldn't be bred for temperament ect. Id love to see someone do a project like that! The same way they did with foxes. We might be surprised at how fast we get a change! I know my babies def. have their mothers personality, and there is evidence for brood temp. affecting the disposition of the hatchlings. (some what at least...) heh
 
I read your thread and find the experiment very interesting. I guess my point is, if it is based on biting, musking, whipping around, vs. short vs. extensive motions to avoid capture, I would be hard pressed to assign a grade, when so many fall somewhere in between. You would also need to find the babies in the exact same position to approach with your hand at the exact same angle, etc. There are immeasurable variables, even if everything is tested the same day at the same time in the same rack. Their conditions can't be identical, when one baby will be out and alert and the next will be dozing under the paper towel, for example. I agree you can "just tell," but I am not sure you can assign a value to it, is all. I think we are not only on the same page, but have the same goal. I am simply less accepting that behavior can be assigned a number with any scientific value -in spite of the fact most of us here would give that animal the same number ourselves. :)
 
I based my criteria off what they used for the silver foxes in Russia. And they've produced dog-tame foxes, including a beautiful little blue merle and white.
 
Another question-has anyone ever bred corns (or other snakes) for size? What I'm noticing is that many snakes seem to end up at rescues and shelters with the reason being "got too big" Even my Wadjet, who is probably not even 4 feet, which isn't large for an adult female corn was relinquished due to size. I also remember at Repticon that a lot of buzz about the Sand Boas was that they stay fairly small. So, I wonder -would it work to breed for smaller than average, but still healthy, snakes, while keeping the temeprment of, say, a corn snake kra ball python, and would that lead to possibly more snakes being kept as lifetime pets?
 
I don't think corns are routinely turned in for being too large, but not a doubt in the world that they couldn't be selectively bred to be larger or smaller.
 
We briefly mentioned this on facebook the other day. Chuck mentioned how corns and the captive-bred population are going in different directions due to different pressures (natural vs. man-made).

I really think it's only a matter of time before the captive-bred population is recognized as a distinct species/subspecies (P.g. domesticus).
 
Actually I was thinking within my lifetime.

Dogs can still breed with wolves, so I wouldn't think that would matter. I guess it all depends on what qualifies a separate species. And I won't even get into all the king/emoryi/gray rat dna that's way more widespread in our collection than many want to admit. :)
 
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Now I will admit there are always exceptions. However, speaking generally... If you bred a Dog to a wolf, chances are-if you are fimiliar with dogs or wolves- you could tell that the offspring were hybrid without knowing their parentage.

Just like when u breed a Domestic shorthaired cat to a serval, if you are familiar with cats or wild cats, you know the off spring are hybrid without being told they are.

But if you bred a CB to a WC corn you would not know the off spring were half CB/WC.
 
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