I couldn't help myself!!!!!

[Zombiegirl]

*stupid computer*

I couldn't stop thinking about him lol.

 

[daddio207]

I can imagine. That's awful that they were euthed and not placed in an educational facility or zoo or something.

How sad that they euthanized them

The euthanization of the snakes was totally unnecessary. NH breeders and keepers like NERDS was just an hour away and would of gladly taken them. Also a local zoo could of also taken them but they rushed to put these snakes to death.

With all the changes in taxonomy a lot of animals go from unrestricted to restricted. The corn snake is one of them that falls in that "grey" area now thanks to the use of Pantherophis guttatus from Elaphe guttata.

 

[axis1]

. . . With all the changes in taxonomy a lot of animals go from unrestricted to restricted. The corn snake is one of them that falls in that "grey" area now thanks to the use of Pantherophis guttatus from Elaphe guttata.

Hi there Daddio! How ya been?

I know I'm definitely NOT the SHARPEST tool in the DRAWER, but NEVER was dumb enough to think a JOLLY RANCHER was a GAY COWBOY!!! :eek1:

That being said, exactly WHEN did the use of Elaphe guttata change to Pantherophis guttatus and what does that MEAN, exactly? Pardon my ignorance, but I DID notice something different when researching something about corns in Wikipedia, but unfortunately it flew over my head like a comb-over on a salesman in a ceiling fan store!

Any and all responses would be greatly appreciated.

(BTW, is that anything like the use of homo sapiens sapiens eventually dropping one of the "sapiens" at the end of that particular term? I thought that it was like that simply because the person who coined the term was one of those guys like the character in Goodfellas named "Jimmy Two-Times" who said everything twice, the example being when he was going to the store, he'd announce, "I'm goin' ta get da papers get da papers," which was his way of saying "I'm going to the store to buy a newspaper, anybody want anything?" I've known many people like him during my upbringing in Brooklyn but would rather use an example of a fictional character in a movie as it prevents all KINDS of problems, ya know? Fuhgeddaboutit!!) :nyah:

 

[HerpsOfNM]

That being said, exactly WHEN did the use of Elaphe guttata change to Pantherophis guttatus and what does that MEAN, exactly? Pardon my ignorance, but I DID notice something different when researching something about corns in Wikipedia, but unfortunately it flew over my head like a comb-over on a salesman in a ceiling fan store!

http://reptile-database.reptarium.c...=guttatus&search_param=((taxon='Colubridae'))

North American rat snakes were moved out of Elaphe around 2000-2002 to distinguish them from old world rat snakes. Even some of the old world rat snakes are no longer Elaphe. Before 2000, only Trans-Pecos and Baja rat snakes were outside of the genus Elaphe for NA rat snakes, having been moved to Bogertophis in the late 80s. I think Dusty Rhoads talks about that split out in his book The Complete Suboc.

Unfortunately, back when NA Elaphe were designated to Pantherophis, I believe only mtDNA (mitochondrial DNA) was used. There is controversy in using that as mtDNA is of maternal lineage. As such, one is overlooking the other half of genetic data within nDNA (nuclear DNA) which is from paternal lineage.

There is also a current common theme of sinking subspecies and "lumping" everything into species. I disagree with this as the whole premise of subspecies is to describe possible phenotypic (visually discernable) geographic variation within a population that could give rise to speciation. That said, my grasping of evolution and taxonomy is not what I would like it to be, mostly due to the fact of bible-thumping public education that doesn't allow one to get any solid foundation of such topic until well into college where the topic basically becomes sink or swim with many biology majors seriously struggling with such a core topic - at least such the case when I was in school (over half my evolution class had C or worse, with a vast number of people I considered very smart failing the course along with me on my 1st try), but a weak argument given the numbers of individuals that understand said controversial topic pre, during, and post my time in high school and college. :fullauto: oke:

Some also argue that much of the herpetological taxonomic work being done is being done just for the sake of it; to merely get published. Case in point, the same group that butchered the black rat snake group, also at one point had successfully published and had peer-accepted use to moving North American rat snakes into the gopher snake genus Pituophis. There's quite a bit of work being done with North American kingsnakes and milk snakes (including Central American milk snakes...technically still North America), with recent publications having many scratching their heads, especially with regard to the "common kingsnake" or geulta group.

 

[axis1]

Wow!! Thank you for the well thought out and extremely intelligent & articulate response! (When I figure out what it means, I will be even MORE grateful!). :eek1:

But seriously, I had no idea that this particular change is going on 15 years! Just goes to show that just ONE area of expertise is difficult enough to maintain. I'm making attempts to know WAY MORE than the human brain was meant to hold! Not that I'm going to stop trying, but your response has brought me back to reality!!

Thanx!!! The info is greatly & sincerely appreciated!

 

[Zombiegirl]

Now that my thread has been sufficiently derailed...... lol

 

[daddio207]

Now that my thread has been sufficiently derailed...... lol

Sorry

Still love that snake ! And want one ! LOL

 

[Zombiegirl]

Still love that snake ! And want one ! LOL

She still has some for sale!

 

[HerpsOfNM]

Now that my thread has been sufficiently derailed...... lol

 

[axis1]

Now that my thread has been sufficiently derailed...... lol

OOPS! :eek1: Don't know if I was the actual cause of it or a perpetrator in some other way, but I know I am definitely guilty of going of on tangents. Can't ALWAYS blame it on medications or a lack thereof, but if it weren't for good old psychiatric disabilities then where would we be?

Now where were we? (Can't for the LIFE of me remember what we were talking about nor what this thread was about originally, but I will look it up and then return with a response. If I REMEMBER!!!!).

That reminds me! I was thinking of starting a new business and wanted to bounce it off of folks I can trust: It has to do with this topic, matter of fact. Not the one the thread is about, because I haven't gone and looked that up yet, but about "memory" or a lack thereof, specifically-speaking: Alzheimer's, which is no laughing matter and which I just may have an early onset of. I heard the other day that they had such a thing as Dialysis Cruises, for people who are on Kidney Dialysis, to all go on together and half the passengers are patients and half are medical staff. The ship goes somewhere for like a week, down to Bermuda or the Bahamas. It gives the patients on dialysis something to do together and a chance to get away and enjoy themselves!

So, that gave me an idea! :idea:

I was thinking of starting an Alzheimer's Cruise, which is much more easy to run. And you don't need as many medical staff either. Most of the passengers could be patients and only a few staff are needed to run it. It would begin in NYC. And it would end in NYC. We could set sail for a week and just circle the island of Manhattan for 7 days. Since all the patients have Alzheimer's, no one would remember the first circle of the island by the time we got to the next one, so every time we circled it would be brand new to them! They would have a genuinely GREAT TIME! And the staff who run it would make a bundle due to the low overhead needed to just circle around Manhattan for 7 days!

(It's just an idea. But whattaya think?) *








*(BTW, before anyone gets genuinely pissed: the preceding is meant just as a joke, at the expense of no one in particular. I happen to work in the mental health field and am aware that these disabilities are devastating in real life. In addition, my own dad passed away from this horrible affliction after a particularly long illness, ten years ago next month! But I believe that laughter is the best medicine, regardless of a diagnosis, and that if you CAN'T or DON'T laugh at yourself and others - as long as it's not at their expense - then you will be in worse trouble than you were ever before! This just my opinion and in no way was meant to hurt anyone's feelings but on the contrary, is just an effort to make people smile a little. I do hope I succeeded!)

 

[DLena]

His face is really lovable. He's going to need a really sweet name.

 

[Zombiegirl]

I am terrible with names! It took me a week to name my dog Lucy lol...I was calling her "little girl" for a week...finally settled on Lucy, although I wanted something different. I did want a classic name because at the time I had Harrison, so I wanted something classy to go with Harrison lol.

 

[HerpsOfNM]

The chondro community has this knack for naming their GTPs, and thus conveniently it's easy to track lineages. Unfortunately, you have to rely on individuals vs having a repository like ACR but it is absolutely nuts on what some of the "regulars" within that community retain of what animals is what and where it came from or has been.

I'm with you though, I've never really been great with naming. Though not seriously superstitious, even having played baseball most of my life, I made the mistake of setting on a theme for my first clutch of GTP eggs back in 2007. 2 weeks later, mom stopped maternally incubating and I had NOTHING in reserve via an incubator for such happening. I quickly got a hovabator up and running, but I'm pretty certain I goofed the temps and humidity. I had babies hatch as I was within the last 2 weeks of incubation when mom came off the clutch, and I started to name them. Not a single one made it. :awcrap: The most annoying part was the strongest one would tease "feed" but 5-10 minutes later I'd find the pinkie on the cage floor. It took 4 months to lose that one. I haven't had chondro eggs since, but I plan to remedy that in the future.

TL; DR...So now I don't name critters until they are established.

 

[Asmodeus]

so when is this handsome boy coming home?? he has the cutest face!!

 

[Zombiegirl]

so when is this handsome boy coming home??

Well I am currently making a plan to go get the rest of my snakes, so hopefully after that and when it cools off a bit I would say, hopefully within the next month or so? It's ideally up to his breeder as she would need/want to ship him in the most optimal temps...that and I need to get his viv and stuff

 

[Zombiegirl]

Updated pics!!! His breeder sent me these yesterday morning after he shed He is so handsome!!! I love his teeny little 'stache lol...I can't wait to meet him in person!

 

[DollysMom]

He is totally adorable. His color is awesome and that face is so engaging!

 

[Zombiegirl]

His color is awesome and that face is so engaging

Right??? His face was what drew me to him lol. I couldn't stop looking at him or thinking about him for a couple days and was so excited when his breeder said he was still available I jumped at the chance to have him lol.

 

[DLena]

Believe you me, many's the face that's gotten me. That and mannerisms. Ours are like that, so is Rufus. They don't bark or purr, or have paws to put on us...so the way they look at us or hold their head...is really very expressive. It's why I love them so much. Their personality really comes through.

 

[DollysMom]

Right??? His face was what drew me to him lol. I couldn't stop looking at him or thinking about him for a couple days and was so excited when his breeder said he was still available I jumped at the chance to have him lol.

Oh heavens yes! I've been there and totally identify. It doesn't matter if they are expensive or rescues either! When you fall in love, you fall in love.

That boy is a total doll. I'm beyond happy for you.