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My first snake

U

ultimatecorns

New member
My first snake... Tell me your opinion!

This guy (Jack) is a wild caught, but tame cornsnake I found in my front yard while raking the leaves in Gainesville, Florida 2002. He is a male hence the name Jack and is believed to have hatched 2001. I also while raking the leaves after catching Jack accidentally killed:( a butter corn only ten feet away from where 2 minutes agao i caught Jack! I beleive he is het for butter and if this is true, when the eggs hatch from the albino we bred him with I will know if they are albino Jack is het for Albino or het for Albino and Caramel (Butter) but if the offspring is Normal then he is just normal. I believe he is het for Butter because of hist color tint and how he changed since we caught him. He started off at 13" when we caught him and looked like a normal or an okeetee hatchling and over the years has changed into this seen below in the picture! Tell me what you think about him and oh yeah a couple days later at dusk I was coming home and caught an Albino male on my unenclosed front porch/patio thats why i think he is het for that stuff above!!!
 

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Also since we caught him we have now acquired a couple hundred other cornsnakes and are waiting for 250 more eggs to hatch. It wasnt clear in what I wrote above so here is what I think he is het for and how I will prove it!!

I think he is het for Albino(Amel.) and Caramel. For shor he is het for Butter!
To prove that he is het for butter i have bred him with an Albino female and when the eggs hatch i will know a little bit more here are the possible outcomes of those eggs:
If the eggs come out:
Albino he is either het for:
Butter
or Albino
If they come out Albino i will hold them back and breed them to each other!!!
If the eggs come out :
Normal he is het for:
Nothing
or something else that has no Albino in it!!
TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK!!!
 
Wow, you have WC Butters and Amel in your 'hood??

Do any of your neighbors have corns that escaped?? :confused:


To your question, lets assume that this WC male is het for Amel and Caramel

If you bred the male to an Amel female:
25% Amel
25% Normal, het Amel
25% Amel, het Caramel
25% Normal, het Amel and Caramel

This would only yield a visual conformation that he is het for Amel. All of the hatchlings would appear to be Amel and Normal. You would have to hold back the entire clutch to prove any het genes like Caramel.

If you bred him to a Butter female:
25% Butter
25% Caramel, het Amel
25% Amel, het Caramel
25% Normal, het Butter

It would be a much faster and cheaper to bred him to a Butter female in order resolve your male's unknown genetics.
 
thanx cav but i forgot to write i might borrow my friends butter female who brumated! yep it is faster to cause then you wont have to hold back the whole clutch if theyre amel and feed them but at the time of writing the thread i didnt know my friend had butter thanx!
no none of my neighbors had corns for that matter but if you want i can try to catch that amel wild male and take a pic although he is agressive when in his figure 8 strike pose! i have auctually now caught him 3 times next time i catch him i might breed him to find out his genes!
 
Wow you are lucky!

I live in Middle TN and we don't have corns wild here and if we did it would be illegal to catch or keep. Blah! Anyway, you are one very lucky person to be able to catch them in your front yard! I think I will move to FL one day!

:cool:
 
Lol

Thanx. It is perfectly legal to catch wild corns here like you said but you dont see them every day. Maybe about 1 every 2 weeks, but that is still good!
 
I have to say that the idea of finding wild caught butter corns (or even amels of any kind of abundance in the wild) is absolutely incredible. And I mean IN-credible!

From where did you acquire your 400 corns? From whom did you get enough education in cornsnake husbandry to care for such a large collection, seeing you have only been into corns for the last year and a half? How many females did you breed this year? How old are those females on average? What was the average number of eggs per clutch? How big are your incubators? How many do you have? Which color morphs are you expecting to hatch this year? How do you know which morphs to expect, if you have not yet proven your breeders?

Personally, I see nothing about the animal shown that would tell me that he is het for anything at all. I certainly wouldn't be suggesting that he is evidence of wild caught caramel's being available in any specific geographic location.
 
Chill

First off, Caramel is native to florida and the first was founded in the central florida area. I accidentally killed a butter corn that was 10' away from Jack. I have caught the Albino male corn 3 or 4 times. Well i acquired most of my corns from a friend S.R.
and others from Kathy Love! Education! Hah if you need an education to take care of corns, boy im not gonna get started. I dont feel comfortable giving out all that info but ill give some. I dont use incubators i live in Florida here its always 80-85 in the summer. Average eggs for 1st clutch is 14. I had one miami female lay 29!!! Well my inquisitive friend, all the morphs im expecting are in my website http://ultimatecornsnakes.com
And it doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out what youre getting and im not listing how to get over 40 morphs/patterns
that are on my website. and should i mention i can get a hatchling to be the first year its alive male or female. I.e. my hypomel female is now 40"
and is a 2002 hatchling. I know more about morphs then you could ever know in 3 lifetimes so buzz off. And if you dont believe me ask me a question about genetics or how to make something or how many generations it will take, gosh. For crying out loud go to ivillage.com take the IQ test and tell me if you even gett abov 50! I got a 163!!!
 
Great info, very interesting......

Is your entire collection 2002s? Can you post some of your breeding and feeding info? I would love to get my corns big enough to breed in a single year!

Also, when did you start breeding to get so many hatchlings so early in the season?

Any info you can provide would be extremely useful for the rest of us!
 
ok

i brumate some in november 1 and some december and all the smaller ones jan 1 which means i dont feed the snkes 10 day before they brumate. i like it this way so that the big snakes can lay first the medium snakes get more time to get bigger and the smaller snakes 34" females and 24" males on jan 1 so they can get an inch or 2 bigger
Feeding: As soon as i get the hatchlings i want i feed it frozen pinkies every 3 days or itil it poops and feed it again then when they are big enough for fuzzies i give em 1 every 3-4 days (until they poop) then i give them live fuzzies then 2 live fuzzies then hopppers same amount of days 3-4 then 2 hoppers then adult mouse then 2! you can stop power feeding males when they are 24-30 inches cause they really onlyy have to be that big to breed and they gain more after coming out of brumaion. stop females once they are anywhere above 36" if you can get them that big 10 days before your brumation. occasionally a female wont breed for some reason it might be because theyre late breeders or they just arent wanting to breed that young. good luck i have already started the corns that are available right now that i am keeping on my website cause i ussually keep back a set (1.2) or 2 sets (2.4) email me with further questions!
 
Yes, the Caramel gene was found in a WC florida corn by Rich Z. However, unless there is someone in your area turning cornsnakes lose out of a private collection, and you said there aren't any of your neighbors with corns, then I would say that I find your story of seeing a butter corn in the wild as being completely unbelieveable. Could I be wrong? Absolutely, but your attitude in your response to my questions tells me that I'm probably not.

Attacking me about my I.Q. is a complete waste of time for you and me. I would be happy to compare numbers about our relative intelligence levels with you, but what would that prove? It would say nothing about your ability to tell the truth, and it would certainly say nothing about your ability to accumulate that many corns in one year and have enough breedings in your first year to produce that many hatchlings!

Furthermore, for you to say that no education is required to breed cornsnakes at the level you say you do is laughable. I was not referring to a formal education. I don't know of many Ph.D. holding corn breeders. However, I WAS referring to the education of experience in dealing with live animals of any type. Every responsible breeder I know says that it is extremely difficult to do what they do on any kind of a consistant basis. Apparently though, you have picked it all up with ease and in just a little over one year, no less! VERY impressive indeed!

Whatever . . .
 
Look

Im sorry i snapped at you and yeah IQ wouldnt prove anything. Also I bought adults from a lady named Esta in Ft. Pierce who is getting out of the bussiness because she is now a new grandma, she had about 10-20 adults and i bought a few that were all brumated and either pregnant or could be bred with right away. I bought 1 male hypomel het for ghost and stripe and 3 female anerys for that male who were het stripe and ghost is what Esta told me. Some albino hurricane het for fun stuff, and some albinos het other fun stuff! I thought u ment by education you were kinda insulting me but yeah ok i understand. People say i have a natural ability with animals, also if youre thinking i trying to scam someone out of their money then ask Kathy Love about me, she will say that i buy many corns from her know a lot about genetics and say i am honest , so dont take my word for it call her!
 
Hmm... Interesting quote from ultimatecorns:
First off, Caramel is native to florida and the first was founded in the central florida area.
Click to expand...

Where did you come up with this information?

I believe I was the first one to ever hatch out a Caramel corn, but apparently you know something I don't.

And you say that Butter and Amelanistic corns are running around wild where you live?

Even more interesting, no doubt.

This is going to be an interesting trip, I think.
 
This thread is quite amusing...

How about you go catch another WC Butter corn and show us a picture? I assume there should be a distinction between a WC and CB as far as appearance.

BTW, your typing skills wouldn't show your IQ of 163.
 
Fine

Ok I'm really confused i thought I read Caramel corns were founded by Rich in Sarasoto, Fl.. With that knowledge since Rich has corrected my source of info, I think Jack is only het for Amel., but I saw what I saw it was a Cornsnake 10' away from where I found Jack that was a yellowish color and the same size as Jack almost as if they were siblings! So when I uncover what he is he for, which could take some time, If he is het for butter, which i doubt now, and breed him to a butter and get butter offspring, boy am I gonna brag, lol, which will really never happen. But, I can confirm it was an Albino Corn I took it to a cornsnake breeder in town and he verified it. So believe what you want folks.
 
CornsnakeKeeper said:


BTW, your typing skills wouldn't show your IQ of 163.
Click to expand...

Harsh! but true, all of those IQ tests on the internet are never accurate. Most people test insanely high even though they are just average.
 
So, you took the cornsnake that a little while ago you were saying was a butter to a breeder and he confirmed it was an amel??? Then why say it was a butter corn?

Or, were you speaking of another amel that you found around your house? OK. But if you're this big breeder now with 400 snakes and dozens of morphs for sale this year, why do you need anyone else to tell you what an amel is?!?!?!?

None of this makes any sense at all. You simply cannot be telling the truth about this stuff, and as you are getting caught, you are trying to change the story! You really ought to just quit this now!

In my opinion, you are a kid (probably a very nice kid) who has tried to make himself look bigger than he is. Fine, you made a mistake . . .kids do that. However, trying to make yourself look bigger than you are and claiming to be producing all of these high dollar morph animals for sale is two different things. You are really bordering upon out and out fraud, and it's time for you to stop while you can before permanent damage is done to your reputation.

Just a couple of quick questions before I go check my email to see if Kathy has replied to me yet . . .

What in the world is a Miami Gold Phase corn???? While you're at it, what exactly is a Tangerine Creamsicle Striped corn??? I found it interesting that you had two new, previously unidentified corn morphs, but no pictures of them on your site!!!! C'mon, kid; it's time to quit.

:mad:
 
Quote: Or, were you speaking of another amel that you found around your house? OK. But if you're this big breeder now with 400 snakes and dozens of morphs for sale this year, why do you need anyone else to tell you what an amel is?!?!?!?

My thoughts exactly... When your 250 corn snake babies start pipping, will you also take each one to the REAL corn snake breeder and ask him/her what each one is. How about you start by posting some pictures of your collection? Why do I have a feeling each picture might have the name SerpenCo in the corner!?;)
 
Feeding: As soon as i get the hatchlings i want i feed it frozen pinkies every 3 days or itil it poops and feed it again then when they are big enough for fuzzies i give em 1 every 3-4 days (until they poop) then i give them live fuzzies then 2 live fuzzies then hopppers same amount of days 3-4 then 2 hoppers then adult mouse then 2!
Click to expand...

Ultimatecorns, on your own website, you have a care sheet posted. On that care sheet, you write, "You can try and "turbo" feed them every three to five days if you wish to speed up their rate of growth. The idea would be to feed them every time they poop. We don't recommend this. Some believe this may actually shorten their lifespan and lower their breeding performance."

Aren't you going against your own advice here? Why are you turbo feeding your snakes when you believe it to be unhealthy for them?
 
Darin Chappell said:
I found it interesting that you had two new, previously unidentified corn morphs, but no pictures of them on your site!!!!
Hey Darin,
How are the "Chief corns" coming along or were you just going to call them amels?;) Change the name and sell a few more at double the price right...:D Now I'm off to change the name of my anerys to "Raiders Corn"...Oh those will be BIG sellers for sure...LOL....



Ken
Click to expand...
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