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When you look under logs....

"On that note I hope they were released. Taking from the wild disrupts natural populations"
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Mass collecting to wholesale 100's or 1000's of them maybe, but one salamander?...I just don't (and never have) think it's wrong for for someone to catch a newt (or salamander, or frog, or garter snake) from the wild to keep as a "pet". Didn't we all start that way as kids? :shrugs:
 
Mass collecting to wholesale 100's or 1000's of them maybe, but one salamander?...I just don't (and never have) think it's wrong for for someone to catch a newt (or salamander, or frog, or garter snake) from the wild to keep as a "pet". Didn't we all start that way as kids? :shrugs:
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You do have a very good point.I'm not taking sides though as I am thinking about W/C myself and haven't settled on a side.

Yes I know the video was a fail so here are pictures...(The all white parts are the lights not spots on him.)
 

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chris68 said:
Mass collecting to wholesale 100's or 1000's of them maybe, but one salamander?...I just don't (and never have) think it's wrong for for someone to catch a newt (or salamander, or frog, or garter snake) from the wild to keep as a "pet". Didn't we all start that way as kids? :shrugs:
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No this is not the right attitude to have these days about collecting wild animals. If every kid (or even 2% of kids) in kept one "pet" wild caught animal- it would change the populations. Especially amphibians, which are already on a serious decline everywhere! It's not just the abundance of populations that matters, its the genetic variation left.

Taking herptofauna from the wild is a serious problem for many species and for the people who study them. Its hard to imagine the impact of taking "only one" from the wild- but you have to remember you are certainly not alone in that mentality...and thats when it becomes a big problem. Animals should not need to be endangered or on the protected-list for them to be negatively impacted by humans .... in order to conserve species we need to prevent them from getting to that stage.

I really just hope that all of us as reptile keepers and herpetologists can learn to appreciate snakes in the wild the same way as snakes in our at home collection. Wild animals deserve to be wild. ;)
 
PS. There are no "sides" to the W/C or Captive bred debate. There is an educated opinion and our innate, greedy, human one (which I am not immune to).

Within each species, each population of those organisms will likely be affected differently. And within those populations, each age class, gender, life stage or even morph might have a different impact if they are removed. For instance, saving hatchling turtles on a beach does nearly nothing to their populations- even if you save thousands... if you want to conserve the species it's MUCH more important to save the adults- specifically the breeding females- for there to be any impact. Information like that is only available on a tiny fraction of animals (ie. commercial fish species)- and in a lot of cases we really don't know what will happen.

However, when it comes to amphibians, we do know some things. 30% of amphibians are already threatened with extinction. As soon as you remove an animal from the wild- it is essentially dead.
 
Calift said:
PS. There are no "sides" to the W/C or Captive bred debate. There is an educated opinion and our innate, greedy, human one (which I am not immune to).
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We'll agree to disagree on that statement. I just don't consider it "greedy" for a child to keep a common herp or two.

Within each species, each population of those organisms will likely be affected differently. And within those populations, each age class, gender, life stage or even morph might have a different impact if they are removed. For instance, saving hatchling turtles on a beach does nearly nothing to their populations- even if you save thousands... if you want to conserve the species it's MUCH more important to save the adults- specifically the breeding females- for there to be any impact. Information like that is only available on a tiny fraction of animals (ie. commercial fish species)- and in a lot of cases we really don't know what will happen.

However, when it comes to amphibians, we do know some things. 30% of amphibians are already threatened with extinction. As soon as you remove an animal from the wild- it is essentially dead.
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Good point's...but...

The destruction of native habitat by those with commercial (i.e $$$) interests in said habitats will do more damage 1000 times over than what one, or every child with an interest in learning about nature while keeping that frog he found in the creek. Pollution, high rates of heavy metals, pesticides, steroids, prescription drugs in our streams in is doing more damage to everything in that creek, more times over than what the removal of one in the interest of learning. I'd rather see a kid totally fascinated holding that frog and jumping online to learn more about the frog he has in a 10 gallon aquarium why they're still to be found :)

Two sides to every coin :*)
 
Agreed with a lot of the above...but I don't think a kid has to keep a wild animal in order to enjoy it. Its much more fun (and easier for the parent) to let them re-find them in their backyard or go look everyday under rocks. Raising tadpoles and releasing the adults can be a fun, harmless project too. Or keeping a bird feeder and identifying the visitors. I think all kids should be exposed to nature which will teach them how cool it is and ultimately why they should respect it. :)

Most likely keeping a few of whatever is common is not going to make a population crash, but I do have the problem with the mentality that taking animals from the wild is okay.
 
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