I finally got my hoggie!!! Introducing Cyrano de Hogerac

You certainly are my daughter, and yes I want one also,
mom

sweet~nichole~marie said:

Oh, really? 1-2 years old??? Holy cow. I have no idea what size a hatchling should be. I was comparing him to corns, in my head, I guess. He is approx. 19g. Well, that is ok. I love him anyway. I think I wanted a young one just because I didn't want an adult that hadn't been handled much and was aggressive. He seems fine with coming out with me so I am happy with him. Ah well, live and learn ~LOL~ Maybe it is better that he is older so I don't have any many feeding problems with him

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If he's only 19 grams, then he is actually still quite young. He just looks so much larger in the pictures, so my bad. I'm just having a hard time thinking he only weighs 19 grams based on those pictures.

For comparison sake, I took some pictures of the differences in size with some of my hognose.

2 week old hatchling ~8 grams


14 month old male ~33 grams


10 month old female ~75 grams

your 10 month old female is absolutely gorgeous. I love her, it is like she is a vanishing stripe. she is so beautiful, congrats,
Marsha

marshaelaine said:

your 10 month old female is absolutely gorgeous. I love her, it is like she is a vanishing stripe. she is so beautiful, congrats,
Marsha

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Thanks Marsha!

That is Twix, our Superconda. Supercondas (patternless) are the super form of an Anaconda (reduced pattern) which is a co-dominant gene. You can also read more about Twix on these 2 threads:

Superconda Super-Package

Twix Progression - Eating pix

Wow, those are gorgeous, Troy. I love the hatchling. Is that one of the anacondas? I love the spots and the color. Oh dang, I have a sinking feeling I will be unable to stick with just one ~LOL~

The difference in size of the older male and female are amazing. She is 4 months younger but almost 3 times the size! That is crazy.

I took a few pics this morning with a dime for reference so that you can get a sense of scale. Maybe I just have small hands? ~LOL~ I also double checked his weight this morning to make sure I was right. He is 18g.

Here are the pics:







Do these help? I will also call the guy I bought him from to see is he can find the hatch date. He didn't have the paperwork with him at the show.

Cyrano is currently sitting curled up on my laptop as I type. I don't think he is quite awake yet

sweet~nichole~marie said:

Wow, those are gorgeous, Troy. I love the hatchling. Is that one of the anacondas? I love the spots and the color.

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Thanks! Yeah, that hatchling is one of our Anacondas. They are really cool morphs and I'm very excited to have 11 more to work with.

Oh dang, I have a sinking feeling I will be unable to stick with just one ~LOL~

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Welcome to the addiction!!! Seriously, I've kept corns and kings exclusively from about '94 to around 2007 when we got our first pair of Western Hognose. My wife and I were instantly enamored with them on so many levels that we pretty much focused our attentions on building up the best collection of hognose that we could barely afford. Needless to say, we're broke now.

The difference in size of the older male and female are amazing. She is 4 months younger but almost 3 times the size! That is crazy.

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For some reason, the Anaconda line has a voracious appetite and Twix was eating about 3 times as much as all the other hognose that I had hatched out 4 months earlier. Our original male Anaconda also has a much more pronounced appetite than most of our other males too. I'm just happy when they eat.

I took a few pics this morning with a dime for reference so that you can get a sense of scale. Maybe I just have small hands? ~LOL~ I also double checked his weight this morning to make sure I was right. He is 18g.

Here are the pics:

Do these help? I will also call the guy I bought him from to see is he can find the hatch date. He didn't have the paperwork with him at the show.

Cyrano is currently sitting curled up on my laptop as I type. I don't think he is quite awake yet

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Yeah, the dime as a point of reference does help a lot. I apologize for my mistake. Going by those pictures and of course his weight, he's definitely less than a year old. Pictures can be so misleading.

Maybe one of these days when I get my act together I will have a table at Wilsonville if just to show off my collection even if I do not have anything for sale at the time. There's not too many of the more exotic hognose up here in the PNW but I hope to change that over time.

Co-dominant, huh? Ok, I was wondering if the different morphs were based on recessive genes like corns or something different.

Troy, is there a good website that explains the hognose genetics?

Ok, I just looked at the feeding pics of Twix. I am getting ready to try feeding Cyrano for the first time. It looks like the pinkie is just a little bigger than her head. At 18g, what weight pinkie do you think I should try? I have 2g, 3g, and 4g in the freezer.

In the feeding thread, you said she was eating every 2-3 days. That is crazy. Do you just go by when you see poo in her tank? Thanks for all the help so far. I appreciate all the info you have given me

I think part of it may have been the angle. I was trying to get good shots of his head and it may have distorted how big he was.

Well, as I said, I am happy with him no matter his age. He is still just chilling on my laptop. I think he is liking the warmth it is generating.

I really hope he is a good eater. I read that some can be finicky.

It would be awesome just to see the different morphs in person, but I think if you had hatchlings to sell you would do well. There seemed to be a lot of interest in the hognoses. I have a feeling if I had put Cyrano down to think about him, someone else would have nabbed him. There were several people watching me as I was checking him out!

sweet~nichole~marie said:

Co-dominant, huh? Ok, I was wondering if the different morphs were based on recessive genes like corns or something different.

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Most of the hognose traits are recessive traits like the Albino, Axanthic, Pink Pastel, T+ Albino (formerly known as Hypo), Toffeebelly, Lavender, Caramel and I believe the Leucistic is recessive too. There are also line traits such as the different varieties of normal's such as the reds, greens, blonds and many others. The Anaconda/Superconda gene is the first Co-Dominant hognose gene that was proven out. There's a couple of other supposed Co-Dominant genes that are currently being worked with but no real defining answers have been proven out yet.

Troy, is there a good website that explains the hognose genetics?

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I'm sure there are several sites that do try to explain the specifics, one I know in particular, but I do not direct anybody to his site because he has questionable ethics at best unfortunately.

Ok, I just looked at the feeding pics of Twix. I am getting ready to try feeding Cyrano for the first time. It looks like the pinkie is just a little bigger than her head. At 18g, what weight pinkie do you think I should try? I have 2g, 3g, and 4g in the freezer.

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To be honest, I never know the weight of the pinkies I feed these guys and the pinkies I buy from Rodent Pro are usually quite variable in size even if they are day olds or what not. Hognose can open their mouths a lot wider and larger than I believe most of my other colubrids can but don't push them into eating too large of a meal as they are typically a smaller snake. Just pick something that is about the same circumference as his body and he should do just fine.

In the feeding thread, you said she was eating every 2-3 days. That is crazy. Do you just go by when you see poo in her tank?

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Actually I go by her actions. Hognose are diurnal snakes, so they hunt during the day and they let you know when they are hungry. If they are out and about cruising very deliberately, chances are they are looking for food, well at least for the females. The males could also just be looking for a mate, so food is not always on their mind, hence the hunger strikes.

Thanks for all the help so far. I appreciate all the info you have given me

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It's been my pleasure. I'm sure you can tell by now that I'm very passionate about hognose.

Oh, shoot, don't tell my mom there is a lavender morph! That is her favorite. ~LOL~ She has spent enough money this year already

Ok, I have got to find a pic of a Leucistic! That would be awesome. I love light snakes with dark eyes. I am not actually that big a fan of snakes with pink eyes. I think they are kinda creepy looking ~LOL~

So, around the same size and when he is searching, or 4-6 days on average ~LOL~ Got it.

I can see how it is easy to become so passionate. They are really cool snakes. I always thought I was strictly a corn girl . . . now I think I am a hognose girl, too!

sweet~nichole~marie said:

It would be awesome just to see the different morphs in person, but I think if you had hatchlings to sell you would do well. There seemed to be a lot of interest in the hognoses. I have a feeling if I had put Cyrano down to think about him, someone else would have nabbed him. There were several people watching me as I was checking him out!

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Well, that's kind of the dilemma. While there is a lot of interest in hognose here on the West coast, you don't really see people spending their money on the more expensive morphs. Heck, even the albinos are still $300 and that's the cheapest morph you can get into for hognose. Everything else is about $800 on up to $7500 (for a snow). The funny thing is, the majority of the hognose breeders are in the Southern and Eastern states and they vend at the Daytona show where you are guaranteed to see practically every hognose morph there is. I've been to that show the last 2 years and it blows my mind. But I've also gone to the big shows in California like the NARBC and Pomona shows and you rarely see anything other than an Albino except for when BHB goes to the NARBC show, then Brian usually brings some Albinos, Pink Pastels and Axanthics, but he doesn't sell too many of them in California like he does elsewhere. And up here in the PNW it's even worse as the economy is a lot different than it is in California and I have to wonder if any people are even buying any of those $500 on up Balls and other fancy stuff you see at our local shows.

Like I said, I'll go just to show off my stuff and get my name out there anyways and if I can sell a $2000 Anaconda, then that'll just be gravy.

Cyrano's first successful feeding!!!

Hehe. Maybe I should start saving up for one of your anacondas. I will start a "hoggy bank". Hey, aren't you up a little late??? ~LOL~

Alright, Cyrano ate!!! Very excited. And of course I had to take pics.

Ok, so first there was a lot of tongue flicking, head butting, and rolling. Then he seemed to lose interest. So I slit the back of the pinkie, thinking maybe he needed a little scent help Presto! He decided it smelled good and latched one. Sweet!

1st - hmmmm, what is this?



Ok, I do want to eat this



Maybe eating it from the end will work better . . .



Almost down!



Just one foot left!



A few chewing motions to get everything back into place



Ah, nice full tummy!



Now, though, I can't hold him for a few days :crying: But I am so glad he ate so quickly the first time!

Oh, and one last pic from earlier this morning. I thought it was funny. Cyrano was giving me pointers on how to resize his photos!

Funny little snake :eats02:

DeadMouse said:

we got our first pair of Western Hognose. My wife and I were instantly enamored with them...
Needless to say, we're broke now.

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I got a little sticker shock looking at some of the morphs too! I'm just trying to find a normal colored male hatchling in the Mid West! Not easy to do. One of the vendors for next weekends MidWest Reptile show has hogs, but nothing hatched for him this year. I'm gonna go anyway and look around, but will probably have to have something shipped.

Boo Hoo, I don't want to wait much longer!

Theresa in Indy

Sorry I missed this thread earlier, but I'm glad to have been your inspiration! Aren't they awesome little snakes? Yours is adorable, and I love the name - sorry he bit you, though. Luckily Charlotte has never bitten me, but she does like to hiss every once in a while.

Btw, I don't think your snake is 1-2 years old, but I only have mine to base the opinion on... have you gotten a weight on him? My girl looks to be about the same size, at ~9 months old, and she currently weighs 75. And yes, the nose digging is just how they try to burrow! Scared me the first time Charlotte did that, since I thought she was trying to chew on me.

Lolo said:

I don't think your snake is 1-2 years old, but I only have mine to base the opinion on... have you gotten a weight on him? My girl looks to be about the same size, at ~9 months old, and she currently weighs 75.

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We had already established that in this thread with this post.

You also cannot always compare a females weight to that of a male of the same age after about 6-10 months as they have way different growth spikes and most males top out at 75-100 grams anyways while a female usually gets to be 300-500 grams. I've had many females that are double the weight of a male at 12 months. Males typically mature within 12-16 months while females mature at more like 18-30 months, sometimes depending heavily on the bloodline/morph such as Pink Pastels which do not normally do as well as say an Anaconda/Superconda.

Awww he's so cute! I love all of the pictures! If you get into creating cool morphs of these guys I'll have to swoop one up from ya!

As far as getting bitten.. I've been bitten by my OBT, a tarantula with supposedly more potent venom than most, and I didn't really have any terrible side effects. "Betty" (my dad named her :smash: ) was only a juvenile then, and she's gotten MUCH more angsty in the past year. I have a feeling that if I were to get bit again the side effects might be worse..
It's just a theory but I think juvenile venom might not be as potent? It's the only thing I can think of to explain why I didn't have as bad of a reaction as I read about online. I even went to the doctor just in case, and they did some quick research, and ended up giving me pain killers "just in case" from what they read! :shrugs:

Glad it didn't affect you too much though!

DeadMouse said:

We had already established that in this thread with this post.

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Yeah, I saw that later... sorry.

You also cannot always compare a females weight to that of a male of the same age after about 6-10 months as they have way different growth spikes and most males top out at 75-100 grams anyways while a female usually gets to be 300-500 grams. I've had many females that are double the weight of a male at 12 months. Males typically mature within 12-16 months while females mature at more like 18-30 months, sometimes depending heavily on the bloodline/morph such as Pink Pastels which do not normally do as well as say an Anaconda/Superconda.

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True, but I knew it couldn't be THAT old! I'm new to Hognoses myself, so I'm still learning - and I forgot about the size difference between males & females.

Congrats Nichole!!! He's so cute. Glad to hear that he's doing well. I love the little piggies -- even when they hiss at you it's cute.

A butt muncher! 2nd Feeding

Thanks Jessica, Lolo, and Nancy! I am so happy with him. He is the sweetest snake in the whole wide world

Yum - pinkie!!! Wrong way, Cyrano!





Cyrano playing in his tunnels