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Copperhead and Cottonmouth

Dunno

Keep thinking & while you're at it ask DanD. That's who I got the parents from. Thanks again! :cheers:Maybe he knows something we don't :shrugs:
 
tsthompson said:
Keep thinking & while you're at it ask DanD. That's who I got the parents from. Thanks again! :cheers:Maybe he knows something we don't :shrugs:
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Addressed to me? Then I don't get what you mean... and are you giant blue berry too? Or did you sell these parents to bberry?
 
tsthompson said:
Keep thinking & while you're at it ask DanD. That's who I got the parents from. Thanks again! :cheers:Maybe he knows something we don't :shrugs:
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Can't see how serious you are... might be pure sarcasm, dunno.... but I said if the breeder is trustworthy, my suggestion is impossible... so if Dan is...
 
Blutengel said:
No hard feelings Jimmy, sometimes I'm more harsh then other days too...

I think there is a miscommunication... my suggestion is not that a butter parent has emoryi influence, cause that would indeed NOT produce more red butter hatchlings but the opposite, I agree on that... my suggestion is, that one of the parents is a very yellow cream (not homo for caramel), maybe het for caramel (causing the yellow), which would produce creams het caramel and 'butter rootbeers'. We all know that cream hatchlings can look quite much alike corn amels.... emoryi would turn the red less red (into orange) as in this hatchling. That is my logic...
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UMMM since the parents originated from Dan? :shrugs: Maybe He knows if there is cream involved. I got them from him as butters. :cool:
 
If they are butter sith emoryi influence, they would surely not produce more red butters, but the opposite.... If Dan knew they had emoryi blood anyway, I suppose he would have told you... Did Dan breed them or buy them from someone else?
 
mkay, hope he turns up here and reads this... his comment might be valuable in this case.. and he might want to know if he kept siblings of the parents.
 
Hey Terri, I'm going over some genetic stuff trying to "educate" myself a little. I wrote down the genes of Copperhead and my caramel mot (newly arrived!) and I'm a bit confused.

*I don't know how to dwarf letters so this might look kinda goofy
So, the Caramel mot is cac cac and Mm Mm

We know copperhead has these genes: aa aa and Mm Mm. But wouldn't he have cac cac mixed in there even if it is just a het?

I'm trying to wrap my head around the logic of getting all caramels only if he's a butter but I can't. I guess I am assuming that he would be het for caramel, but looking at his parents even if he end up being an amel it seems to me that he would at least be het. Is this correct?

The little guy was freshly shed about a week ago and I've got some pictures, but my schedule this week has been crazy. Finals are happening in some classes and coming up in others. Also, now that my computer isn't over at my boyfriend's house it's a lot harder to get pictures on my computer. I recently moved and my camera's usb cord is no where I can find it.
I'll try to get some pictures up tomorrow though if I can remember to steal the usb cord tonight! In a few days I'll probably get a few pictures of the caramel motley girl as well. She looked to be in shed when I put her in her new home on Tuesday, so I think I'll wait until she's comfortable and in fresh skin. =)
 
GiantBlueberry said:
Hey Terri, I'm going over some genetic stuff trying to "educate" myself a little. I wrote down the genes of Copperhead and my caramel mot (newly arrived!) and I'm a bit confused.

*I don't know how to dwarf letters so this might look kinda goofy
So, the Caramel mot is cac cac and Mm Mm

We know copperhead has these genes: aa aa and Mm Mm. But wouldn't he have cac cac mixed in there even if it is just a het?

I'm trying to wrap my head around the logic of getting all caramels only if he's a butter but I can't. I guess I am assuming that he would be het for caramel, but looking at his parents even if he end up being an amel it seems to me that he would at least be het. Is this correct?

The little guy was freshly shed about a week ago and I've got some pictures, but my schedule this week has been crazy. Finals are happening in some classes and coming up in others. Also, now that my computer isn't over at my boyfriend's house it's a lot harder to get pictures on my computer. I recently moved and my camera's usb cord is no where I can find it.
I'll try to get some pictures up tomorrow though if I can remember to steal the usb cord tonight! In a few days I'll probably get a few pictures of the caramel motley girl as well. She looked to be in shed when I put her in her new home on Tuesday, so I think I'll wait until she's comfortable and in fresh skin. =)
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I am not the best at writing the genetic stuff out, but I will try to help. I think most often just 2 letters are used for each allele. Usually capital letters are used for the dominant allele and lowercase for a recessive (by the way, I tend to get my terminology mixed up so I am not sure if I am calling things by their proper names.). Since caramel and motley are recessive genes, I believe your caramel motley girl would be shown as ccmm. If Copperhead is a butter motley he would be shown as aaccmm. NOW...since the caramel motley is not amel, I believe you would use AA to show that if you were doing a Punnett Square...so she would be AAccmm. If Copperhead is only het for caramel, he would be aaCcmm.

With the first scenario (Copperhead being a butter motley), all the babies would inherit one gene from each parent for each "mutation" (amel, caramel, and motley). Since both parents are homozygous motley the babies will all get one recessive motley gene from each...so they will all end up mm (homozygous motley). This would be the same with the caramel gene. All the babies will by cc (homozygous caramel). With the amel gene, the mom can only pass down A and the dad can only pass down a. All of the babies will end up Aa (or het amel). So all the babies will be Aaccmm (caramel motley het amel).

Now...if Copperhead is simply het caramel, he would be aaCcmm. When those are combined with mom's genes, you will get the following:
All of the babies will be homozygous motley (mm) and heterozygous amel (Aa) still since those genes haven't changed. Mom can still only pass down the recessive caramel gene so all the babies will get a "c" from her. Copperhead, however, has "C" and "c." Approximately half of the babies will get C and half will get c. That means that half of the babies will be AaCcmm and half will be Aaccmm. Their phenotypes will be approximately 50% normal motley het amel and caramel and 50% caramel motley het amel.

I hope this makes sense to you!
 
Thanks for taking the time to write that out! It does make a little more sense. I was looking at VMS' genetics page so that's where I got all the capital letters from.. and yea, I was a little confused about it. The lower and capital letters for dominant and recessive make sense though.
I guess I have 3 years to understand this stuff a bit more! Yikes.
**will not power feed, will not power feed***

As soon as I get home today I'll get some picture updates! Thank you again
 
GiantBlueberry said:
Thanks for taking the time to write that out! It does make a little more sense. I was looking at VMS' genetics page so that's where I got all the capital letters from.. and yea, I was a little confused about it. The lower and capital letters for dominant and recessive make sense though.
I guess I have 3 years to understand this stuff a bit more! Yikes.
**will not power feed, will not power feed***

As soon as I get home today I'll get some picture updates! Thank you again
Click to expand...
You're welcome! I am glad that I was able to help a bit. For a more detailed tutorial, please visit http://www.serpwidgets.com/Genetics/genetics.html

Chuck Pritzel (Serpwidgets) also has a wonderful book out that is a must have!
http://www.cornguide.com/the guide.php

Good luck! I look forward to some updated pics (and pics of your new little one, as well)!
 
Here are a few picture updates.

The full body shot was taken a few days ago and the tail shot was taken about a week ago. Flash on the body shot, no flash on the tail.

copperheadeating.jpg


tail.jpg

I just love that tail.
 
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