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Random thought

Darcpixie said:
Are their beliefs one of the reasons we have singled them out? Indeed. Is it easy to separate everyone that is not included in that group with the only titles we have to describe them? No, not at all.
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Why can't most of you see how ironic it is that you are pretty much saying "It is so out of line that you are pushing your beliefs on me, now let me push mine on you!!"?

If you feel the burning need to attack him, why not do that, and not attack not everything he *could* be associated with?

Also ironic that people are offended by the posters abusive language towards women, and then turn around and use abusive language towards those with beliefs other than their own.

I find offensive statements on both sides and really most people here are proving that one side really isn't better than the other. Non-religous can be just as nasty and pushy about thier beliefs as religous people.

Which is blacker? The kettle or the pot?

I looked up the definition of religion today, from what I read, everyone here has a religion of some form.

Darcpixie said:
But how else should we go about it.

Just a thought.
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Since you asked....

If you must, sinlge out what ideas you disagree with, don't lump whole populations with his ideas. I am REALLY wondering why everyone cares. But if you do, and you actually think you are going to convert this person to your own religion... than I would appreciate if you do it privately please.

Then again, that is just my opinion and belief. If y'all want to have a battle of religion than that is your business. I just thougt I'd come and play the Devil's advocate.

:devil01:
 
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Darcpixie said:
Carol, Fred, Outcast, et al.

That's the thing. Vagaries of the english language prevent us from succinctly separating people similar to Lavender in belief and scope and type from those who are NOT of that particular bent.
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Well maybe Lavender has the same constraints regarding his views of women? Maybe your comments are based on what you've personally seen of religion. Maybe his comments are based on what he's personally seen with women. Maybe he doesn't feel that way about all women but English language just doesn't allow him to be more specific.

If that's what you are selling, do you buy it?

:shrugs:
 
My favorite professor was also an ordained minister. He helped mold my view on Christianity from the complete aversion I felt from childhood to acceptance. He also cleared up many of my misconceptions and gentled the image of the harsh God as he put the bible within a historical setting. He is now in Tibet working on religious tolerance within that torn up section of the world. He has had numerous meetings with the Dali Lama as well as Islamic Mullahs. He is one of the men I respect because of his desire to work with other faiths to promote peace and not division.

I told him about the angel I saw and he gave me the clarity I needed. Before that whenever I told someone the story they asked me what I was smoking.
 
I personally have an aversion to people who use their beliefs or their religion to hurt other people.
Religion is supposed to comfort, enlighten and free us. It is not to be used to hurt or belittle someone.
 
No, I don't think I have a religion of some form, I don't incorporate any religious ritual or way of thinking in my life, I just believe in my capabilities, in what I can and should do and should not do to hopefully live a good life without hurting people and enjoy it most of the time myself. I hope people don't see me as forcing my beliefs onto others, since I don't believe, I reason, because I know enough facts to see evolution as the truth and reject the idea of an omnipotent being having created this all, especially when it would be done in six days. Neither can I really fit the idea of eternal souls into the scientifical world I know. But IMO logic and fanatic Christianity don't mingle very well so there is nou use disussing it, but both sides should respect each oher and let be.

What does throw me off my feet a bit however is a certain Scottish medium who really seems to be able to speak with dead people, my logic tells me his show can't be fake beacuse of all the details he knows of multiple people and their family and houses and such in one show. If all those guests would be working with him to set up a fake show for many seasons, sooner or later the audience would find out, I'm pretty sure of that. It has occured with a fake show by someone else, it was gone halfway the season. Anyway, because of that medium I cannot but believe logically that the soul does remain after death, and they meet up with beloved ones and guard their family and friends that are still alive. So how about that; I reasoned myself into believing something I can't understand... when I realised that I really had to give it a place.
 
A big difference I don't go around telling people if you don't believe in my deity you will burn in hell. I don't condemn anyones belief or non belief with eternal damnation. I don't tell someone they are more or less then me because of their sex, sexuality, race, station in life...
The OP would have his 'mama' burn in the fire of hell, what does that say.
 
There is no proof that there is a God.
There is no proof that there isn't a God.
This is an age old debate, an age old argument that will get nowhere because it's all based on belief.. faith.
To see people become heated about it like this just shows how silly we as humans can be.
Why argue over something that there is no evidence of either way?

If we observe from a strictly scientific standpoint, there are many things that bother me. First being, who I am is solely determined by my neurons, brain cells, synapses, etc. When I die, all of that dies as well. How do we maintain who and what we are? Obviously, IF there is an afterlife, it's going to be a lot more than anything our simple minds can derive - there's obviously going to be no human emotion attached. If God exists and if he is omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient than, again, he is going to be a lot more than we understand and again, no human emotion would apply.
This seems to be the largest failure I see in these debates - human emotion is ALWAYS applied to God, when this would just be totally illogical - "God is mean", "God is loving" yadda yadda. As far as I am concerned, if such a being exists, it's beyond our ability to interpret its existence.

Do I believe that there is a greater being? Yes. I am right there with Carol and Fred on how I feel about this thread. I grew up as a Christian but I also am an engineer and love science. If I take one thing from the bible and my beliefs, it's that we are sheep. We are CLEARLY sheep. We cannot even begin to fathom a being with the attributes that we apply to God.
 
Carol, you got rep, and get an A+ from me in socio-philosophical relativity.

'Perfect objectivity' is as fleeting and rare as 'Perfection' itself.

Nice to see one so skillfully conjure up a little here. ;)

So is 100% leaving one's "personal belief system" out of the conversation/debate. Rare, and no simple thing to do.
Live and let live.....is much more easily said...than done.
 
Also, I just wanted to point out that it is highly unlikely that this 'Lavender' believes anything he is posting and he is probably posting for the sole intent of starting a fight on this forum. He is stirring the pot and wants to see heated debate among friends.

He just went out to the playground and told Becky that her best friend Susanne Likes her boyfriend Frankie, and that they were caught kissing behind the stadium.
 
Tara80 said:
Also, I just wanted to point out that it is highly unlikely that this 'Lavender' believes anything he is posting and he is probably posting for the sole intent of starting a fight on this forum. He is stirring the pot and wants to see heated debate among friends.

He just went out to the playground and told Becky that her best friend Susanne Likes her boyfriend Frankie, and that they were caught kissing behind the stadium.
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Anyone notice how he hasn't been back?
 
I noticed several posts ago. If you look at his posts in other forums since they are very civil, unless I missed some. I concur about stirring the pot.
 
carol said:
Why can't most of you see how ironic it is that you are pretty much saying "It is so out of line that you are pushing your beliefs on me, now let me push mine on you!!"?
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Does ones' personal spiritual beliefs and convictions uphold them when they experience adversity, or to they resort to name calling & fighting & drama?
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How effective is your chosen spiritual belief system? Did you choose it for yourself? Did someone else try to re-create you in their personal image (possibly since before you had a vocabulary) who was not God or whatever you want to call that?

(overcoming codependency in the church, there's a mess of self-help books on the subject)

What is the point of a discussion if nobody is listening?

These were rhetorical questions.
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Tara80 said:
Also, I just wanted to point out that it is highly unlikely that this 'Lavender' believes anything he is posting and he is probably posting for the sole intent of starting a fight on this forum. He is stirring the pot and wants to see heated debate among friends.
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I am not that psychic. I am fallible though, so I might be wrong.
 
The_Thunderer said:
Reading this thread has been "painful" for me. On one hand, we have this person apparently "Christian" making obnoxious and incendiary statements that leave himself AND his religion - which I share but in a completely different way than he does - a target of ridicule.

On the other - perhaps rightfully so - given the nature of the OP, we have folks - many whom I consider "friends" on this site - attacking a belief system that I happen to be a part of... a belief system
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Outcast said:
seeing my beliefs attacked by the other members here, has left me somewhat sad. Though I knew it would happen, because religious discussions always lead to how evil Christianity is..
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carol said:
I agree Fred. It's amazing to me that people are upset at one person and have pretty much turned to attacking religion. I am Christian. I don't believe in a firey hell. Hades is death, and "the dead are concious of nothing at all" according to my beliefs. But that is a whole different conversation.

It doesn't make much sense to see people here boost to be too enlightened and intellegent to believe in God but can't be enlightened or intellegent enough to not make sterotypical group bashings.
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But... I think....this is the way it must be.

I have faith, now say what you must.


I have faith.
 
Sorry for the abrupt subject change, but first things first...LOL...

So....anyone/everyone...can place two tags on any given thread?
Hmmmm...seems like could be trouble, Folks! Right here in River City. Trouble, with a capital T and that rhymes with P and that stands for pool.
 
Hypancistrus said:
I fully realize that 99% of Christians (and probably the same number of Islamics) are decent, hard-working people who just want to live their lives by their own faith. But it's long past time for them to "put a leash" on their out of control brethren-- time for all the peaceful Christians and Muslims to say "Hey, you're out of line," to the nutters that are blowing things up and using their religion as a battering ram to force through oppressive laws.
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I have seen plenty of people voice that. I have no control over extremists any more than you, as an animal lover, have control over PETA. In a similar fashion, linking a religious person with extremists is like linking animal lovers to PETA. It would make you mad wouldn't it?

susang said:
A big difference I don't go around telling people if you don't believe in my deity you will burn in hell. I don't condemn anyones belief or non belief with eternal damnation. I don't tell someone they are more or less then me because of their sex, sexuality, race, station in life...
The OP would have his 'mama' burn in the fire of hell, what does that say.
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I just don't see why it irks people so badly. I do not believe in hellfire. I have been told plenty of times I am going to burn in hell. I don't believe it is true and hence it rolls off my back like many other things I don't agree with. :shrugs:
 
Nanci said:
I tell people who tell me snake killing stories that they are going to burn in hell...
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LOL!

I once scared Connie's mom pretty badly. She lives near a farm in Delaware and they had an old rundown shack in the back. It was well known to me that she would kill the black rat snakes she found around there. Well, one day we were visiting and of course I'm poking around looking for snakes. And sure enough I found a fully opaque black rat snake laying under some boards. I had an idea, so I took the snake and brought it to Connie's mom. Obviously she had never seen a snake looking like that and asked what it was. I told her it's a ghost of one of the snakes she had killed. Her eyes got as wide as saucers.... :rofl:

I did tell her later what it really is, but I really don't think she believed the second explanation.

In any event, I don't think she kills snakes any longer...
 
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