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Scale less Corns anyone?

So by selectively keeping and breeding (cows) we have actually naturally selected our own pastoral populations to take advantage of milk. AKA. NOT digesting milk was a weakness that caused die off OR people with a lactose tolerance had more offspring and thus make up more of the population. Nowadays we have messed it up with pasteurization and such (not necessarily "being bred into", tricksterpup but excellent post).

The apparent convergent evolution of lactase persistence among human populations is best explained as an adaptive response to the shared selective pressure resulting from domestication of dairy animals and consumption of milk during adulthood. Indeed, sequencing of DNA from skeletal remains of eight neolithic individuals who lived across Europe between 5800 and 5000 years BC revealed that all were homozygous for the lactase non-persistence allele, lending support to the hypothesis that the lactose-persistence mutation was selected for following the domestication of dairy animals.
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Raw milk contains harmless bacteria which produce lactase which, in turn, enables the human body to break down and absorb lactose. Pasteurized milk has had all of these bacteria killed off and is therefore lactase-free, but still contains lactose, causing problems for many people who try to drink it.
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I like the look of the scaleless corn snakes and I bet they feel like crested geckos (thin silky suede). However I think the scaleless beardies look sad, like melting wax :nope: and I want to try some raw milk!
 
You can find better evidence to support that hypothesis today: cultures that drank milk historically have a lower rate of being lactose-intolerant than cultures that didn't drink milk. You can look at modern populations and look at the level of lactose intolerance against milk drinking as a selective pressure in that particular groups evolutionary history, in other words.

Unpasteurized milk actually has a good flavor (I like it) once you get past the thicker texture than we are used to) and the hair (if you are a poor milker.....lol). Still, there IS a reason why unpasteurized milk isn't sold in the US......and I group fresh milk with raw oysters. Tastes goodbut not worth getting sick over.....lol.

As far as the scaleless corns, I lost all interest in them as soon as it came out that they were all just rootbeer (i.e., corn x emoryi hybrids) and not pure corns at all. Such a shame. I wanted some, and now I'd rather they didn't exist at all. :(
KJ
 
KJUN said:
As far as the scaleless corns, I lost all interest in them as soon as it came out that they were all just rootbeer (i.e., corn x emoryi hybrids) and not pure corns at all. Such a shame. I wanted some, and now I'd rather they didn't exist at all. :(
KJ
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Do you have a citation on that one so I can read up about it? Last I'd read they were presumed still pure corn... but I haven't been deliberately looking for threads or articles or radio posts about it.
 
Ssthisto said:
Do you have a citation on that one so I can read up about it? Last I'd read they were presumed still pure corn... but I haven't been deliberately looking for threads or articles or radio posts about it.
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I might be able to find the link, but the creator who started them across the pond wrote his story about their origin. Came from the surviving egg of an emory X cornsnake cross. Not an obsoleta cross like some people accused - but a "rootbeer" cross. Give me a couple of days to look for the link again if you can find it. (There is an English version of the website, too....since I was able to read it....lol.)
 
Scaless

So a scaless corn was hatched out from breeding emoryi to a cornsnake? Not that I would ever own one.I know it wasnt a wild caught animal so what as bred together that someone hatched out a scaless cornsnake?:shrugs:
 
I've seen the scaless corn and to me it does look like a hybrid..the reason why is that the breeder that produced them, he first had scaless rat snakes for years..it makes you wonder if he in fact did a crossing of a scaless rat to a normal corn???
 
KJUN said:
I might be able to find the link, but the creator who started them across the pond wrote his story about their origin. Came from the surviving egg of an emory X cornsnake cross. Not an obsoleta cross like some people accused - but a "rootbeer" cross. Give me a couple of days to look for the link again if you can find it. (There is an English version of the website, too....since I was able to read it....lol.)
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Are we sure that the scaleless corns that, for example, BHB has - are the same animals as the Emoryi crosses? If the original site you mentioned was in French I think I've found it, and some of the photos do look familiar. But that doesn't mean that all of them are of the same origin, does it?

stephen said:
So a scaless corn was hatched out from breeding emoryi to a cornsnake? Not that I would ever own one.I know it wasnt a wild caught animal so what as bred together that someone hatched out a scaless cornsnake?:shrugs:
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It would be entirely possible to find a wild scaleless corn. Just because it may not have happened yet doesn't mean it can't or won't happen.
 
Ssthisto said:
Are we sure that the scaleless corns that, for example, BHB has - are the same animals as the Emoryi crosses? If the original site you mentioned was in French I think I've found it, and some of the photos do look familiar. But that doesn't mean that all of them are of the same origin, does it?


It would be entirely possible to find a wild scaleless corn. Just because it may not have happened yet doesn't mean it can't or won't happen.
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Supposedly THAT is the guy that sold the first ones to BHB, so I find it hard to believe that there are 2 origins (one pure, one not) from the SAME originator....lol.
 
Yess, they originated with French person.

His are originally from Emoryi X Corn but at least one of that original pair are now dead as they were fairly old when they were first bred.

BHB bought their scaleless snakes from him, HOWEVER BHB 'seem' to be advertising them as pure corn although I haven't had a reply to my direct email asking if they were pure or not.

All scaleless corns which came from that line have some hybrid blood in them but the originator has been breeding the scaleless into corns 'ONLY' to decrease the hybrind blood in them.
 
I agree. I felt that the investment value of these animals went from high to "just another hybrid" as soon as that info was learned...and my personal interest went from very high to, well, disgust. :( To give the European credit, i don't get the feeling that he EVER tried to represent them dishonestly. It is news to us HERE, but he posted the history on the web. It isn't like he was hiding anything. Kudos to him for that!
 
Hmm, The greatest shame in my view is that original pure* corn that carried the gene couldn't have been bred to another pure* corn to create a clutch of pure* corn poss hets.

*pureness being relative...
 
torsten said:
Hmm, The greatest shame in my view is that original pure* corn that carried the gene couldn't have been bred to another pure* corn to create a clutch of pure* corn poss hets.

*pureness being relative...
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Even greater shame, is that the pure emroyi was lost, for the same reasons. :)
 
True, but were either bred to anything else before they were put together? Perhaps there are poss hets hanging around somewhere...
 
torsten said:
True, but were either bred to anything else before they were put together? Perhaps there are poss hets hanging around somewhere...
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I am sure they were, but if it was not discovered until late in the original breeders lives, then it is likely that the "pure" offspring were dispersed and their current owners have no idea. The current owners of possible hets would have to have kept the right offspring and breed them back to the parent, not real likely unfortunately.
 
Same thing happened with the first anerythristic "alterna" that resulted in crossing a mex-mex to an alterna...and then the adults were dispersed before the eggs hatched. The potential for pure aners in both subspecies was lost (at least for a few years) from that mistake.
 
KJUN said:
...and then the adults were dispersed before the eggs hatched.
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One major reason I try to never sell the adults until the eggs hatched. So far, it hasn't done me any major good......but I'm sure the time I decided to do it I'll see something amazing.
 
This has been a great thread to read through. It's too bad I can't see the pics. I'd be interested in giving these snakes a lookin at, and see what they're like up close.

Good job to BT for starting the thread!

Leim
 
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