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stupid breeders why cant you just leave things be

Christen said:
Really? :p There has been tons of arguments in this thread but not once has their been one about Who is smarter American's or Europeans? But it seems our friend reptilegeek is doing his best to make the next disagreement about that.
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Oh. That. So much has been discussed in this thread. Guess I need to go back to the beginning and read it all over again. Except for yours, I didn't see where RG got any replies. There's a saying about that.

Is it okay to cohab hybrids?
 
Carpe Serpentis said:
2. I've heard that pure cornsnakes cohabit fine. Any thoughts or clarifications on this anyone?
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You have heard bad information in my opinion. I have wild-collected corns for many years. The coastal SC snakes, particularly Okeetees were/are the wildest corn babies I have still ever worked with. Very, very few "domestic" corns have this attitude or feeding response -which is why I believe a captive baby cornsnake released in Okeetee has practically no chance of survival.
v5ebth.jpg

If you were slow to split up babies, they often would flat out eat each other. And it's amazing how little resistance a baby snake puts up to being swallowed (sans constriction). As for adults, there has been occasion I paired them to breed at the wrong time and they all but fought. Now someone can try to sell that since Rich has turned cornsnakes loose up and down the Carolinas, the animals I caught myself aren't pure but in fact have .0000000000000000001% hybrid blood, but I ain't buying.
 
elrojo said:
You have heard bad information in my opinion. I have wild-collected corns for many years. The coastal SC snakes, particularly Okeetees were/are the wildest corn babies I have still ever worked with. Very, very few "domestic" corns have this attitude or feeding response -which is why I believe a captive baby cornsnake released in Okeetee has practically no chance of survival.
v5ebth.jpg

If you were slow to split up babies, they often would flat out eat each other. And it's amazing how little resistance a baby snake puts up to being swallowed (sans constriction). As for adults, there has been occasion I paired them to breed at the wrong time and they all but fought. Now someone can try to sell that since Rich has turned cornsnakes loose up and down the Carolinas, the animals I caught myself aren't pure but in fact have .0000000000000000001% hybrid blood, but I ain't buying.
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Would the corns eat each other simply because they are hungry or because one of the corns just ate and has the aroma of rodents on it?
 
ReptileGeek181 said:
Would the corns eat each other simply because they are hungry or because one of the corns just ate and has the aroma of rodents on it?
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It happened right out of the egg, before ever being offered a meal, I have to think it was simply exploring their world and learning what could be food. Man, does a baby snake in another baby snake's belly ever distend the animal!

And Dave, I've had non Okeetees fight also. I've always wondered what goes on totally unseen to who cohab and say it works fine for them.
 
elrojo said:
And Dave, I've had non Okeetees fight also. I've always wondered what goes on totally unseen to who cohab and say it works fine for them.
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I keep all of mine housed individually after their first shed and throughout their lives, but I have seen instances of adults which were always cohabbed and never had a problem. I suspect conditioning, variety/morph/locality-type has much to do with the risks, especially when previously individually housed snakes are made to co-hab.
 
So elrojo you are suggesting we co-habbers lie about mishaps and keep practicing at even though our corns eat each other all the time?

I do wonder what happens unknown by us in all those hatchling piles I see on photo's all the time...
 
I only co-hab cbb babies in small groups of 3, I feed separately and wash each off as a precaution. And I have never had a problem.

Honestly speaking, I do this as a convenience to me.
 
dave partington said:
Oh. That. So much has been discussed in this thread. Guess I need to go back to the beginning and read it all over again. Except for yours, I didn't see where RG got any replies. There's a saying about that.

Is it okay to cohab hybrids?
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Are you seriously suggesting that I was in the wrong for telling someone to quit calling us stupid?
 
ReptileGeek181 said:
I only co-hab cbb babies in small groups of 3, I feed separately and wash each off as a precaution. And I have never had a problem.

Honestly speaking, I do this as a convenience to me.
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Obviously whatever works for you is fine, but having to wash each baby seems more inconvenient than just housing them separately in small-ish containers.
 
It isn't like you can say he didn't want a reaction. Why would he post it twice if he didn't want a reaction.
 
TBH I was more offended that he called me a Bro and Autumn a dude. But I let those slide since we aren't in person and clearly can see we aren't bros or dudes.
 
I would like to quote Rich Z:

You know, I haven't thrown a "fella" comment around for quite a while, so how about you all making an effort to make this conversation more civil so I don't have to do so now. I'm not about to read back to find out who said what and who started what, so I will just have to put as many people as necessary on the bench for a few days if I have to.

Yeah, some people like hybrids, and some people don't. Big deal. Live with it and move on. It's not a taboo topic here, but personally derogatory comments towards other members ARE.
 
Wow this thread just took a turn for the even worse. Can we make a movie reference to Wrong turn?

I think some start to get a rise out of others. They did so on purpose. They continue to read into what others say and put meaning to what others say which are not there just to cause more drama. The name calling should stop. It doesn't matter if it was south americans, central americans or north american who he was referring to. It was name calling.
 
Carpe Serpentis said:
My 21 cents again.
1. If you breed even a pure species to improve upon it, then you are seeking to change the status quo and thus... you are not truly satisfied with it... or else why seek change... thus.... it is not such a far leap to consider my idea of hybridizing to further that change... in effect... to speed it up as the genetic pool becomes larger with hybrids and thus the possibilities increase as well. Arguing over how much to hybridize and how much the snake must look like a hybrid versus a corn marginalizes the corn morphs we already have because of hybridizing and the genes that are utilized for certain morphs that came from other species.
2. I've heard that pure cornsnakes cohabit fine. Its those that have a bit of something else hidden in them that don't cohabit quite so well. If this is true, then one would want to cohabit cornsnakes to eliminate or figure out which cornsnakes exhibited a non-corn behavior. In this manner, one could at least select for cornsnake behavior... even if one were to continue to keep the noncornsnake genes for color/pattern, etc. for creating new morphs. For me, it is a matter of selecting out the traits you desire to keep as well as the traits you desire to add. There is no point in making a hybrid that does not give some new phenotype to a corn or corn hybrid. Any thoughts or clarifications on this anyone?
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The creation of hybrids does not enlarge the genetic pool, but rather taints it with foreign blood. Mass breedings of jungle corns and what not only pollutes the natural or pure corn genetic pool. The genetic pool is getting muckier and slushier with the selling and eventual breeding of hybrids.
 
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