What happens to a deer. (WARNING:Carnage shots)

[medusacoils]

Its not that crazy when the animals are more intelligent then we are.

Exactly!!!

 

[JustineNYC]

So because I choose to take an animal, by a legal method that automatically means that I enjoy killing. Sorry but NO! I have never enjoyed taking any animals life! I do enjoy the sport of the chase though!

You dont NOT enjoy it, do you? Because then you wouldn't do it.

Your butcher doesnt sell deer? There are always going to be slaughter houses and markets to provide you with anything that may tickle your fancy. If they keep killing, and people like you keeping killing....how long before that drastically affects us? Never right? Because you live in a bubble?

I am sorry, but your entire argument makes no sense. It's the same drivel that organizations like PETA and HSUS have been spewing for years. All of which has been proven false by study and evidence. It's time to stop listening to the rhetoric and start reading.

Wayne

Drivel? Are you kidding? Are you totally ignorant to the daily lose of wildlife habitat? You seriously believe wildlifes population is growing and growing and loss of land for them to live on has absolutely no bearing on the fact that they walk through and are encroaching on suburban areas?

The only drivel is from YOU. How scarey that someone could be so ignorant.

 

[JustineNYC]

Exactly!!!

You know.....Was it absolutely necessary for you to be rude while making your case? I was never rude to you yet you post to me like Im a flipping retard.

Either you know you have no point, or you possess no intelligence to make it. Either way you have proven to me why I dont support hunting or the morons who do it.

 

[medusacoils]

No, but there is a possiblity of us loosing our natural resources. This can be from pollution, man moving into areas where the wildlife live, ect.

Lets take for example many of the Large MN snakes, bulls, black rats and even the Timber Rattler. These guys are disappearing more and more. Heck even Garters are slowly vanishing from the outskirts of the cities. They are no longer in the numbers they once were.
Heck, When was the last time you sat outside and seen lighting bugs light up your yard? I can tell you those days have been very few. I only live a few miles from you and I get excited when I see one.
we will always have cows, chickens, and other barn yard animals but will we still have wolves? Bears? The numbers are coming back up but they are still on the fence and can fall off in a bad way.

I think a lot of the declines in insects, can be attributed to the climate change. I am not seeing the drastic changes that you have with the exception of preying mantises. I haven't seen one of then in a few years.

Also, a lot of the increases in numbers of bears, wolves, etc can be attributed to hunting dollars. People do not realize that the money I pay for my hunting license or when I buy ammo, that it benefits programs like that. (The LACEY Act)

I am not totally disagreeing with Hunting. I agree, the main urban cockroach is the deer. But why is that? well we killed off the Bear, the wolf and bob cats. So we have to step up and start to take care of those populations. But if we learn to do Land Management, maybe we do not have to do so much culling.

"WE" did not kill of these predators, our ancestors did. Now, it is "our" responsibility to fix their mistakes. Culling/Hunting is a safe, viable and inexpensive way of doing that, to control animal populations! Reintroduction of predatory animals, may seem like a good idea, but in reality, it's not. Too dangerous and their range/habitat is far too small to sustain them. Especially around here!

I really enjoy having this conversation with you. I may not agree with you completely, but I am enjoying it. I can definitely see where you are coming from. It's not the rhetoric that some people seem to base their arguments on!

Thank You

Wayne

 

[medusacoils]

You know.....Was it absolutely necessary for you to be rude while making your case? I was never rude to you yet you post to me like Im a flipping retard.

Either you know you have no point, or you possess no intelligence to make it. Either way you have proven to me why I dont support hunting or the morons who do it.

All I did was go and agree with a statement you made and you go and make inflammatory remarks. Then start calling me names. That adds a lot of credence to your argument and is typical of people in your position! NICE!!

Thanks for the help!!

Wayne

 

[MedusaCorns]

You dont NOT enjoy it, do you? Because then you wouldn't do it.

Your butcher doesnt sell deer? There are always going to be slaughter houses and markets to provide you with anything that may tickle your fancy. If they keep killing, and people like you keeping killing....how long before that drastically affects us? Never right? Because you live in a bubble?







Drivel? Are you kidding? Are you totally ignorant to the daily lose of wildlife habitat? You seriously believe wildlifes population is growing and growing and loss of land for them to live on has absolutely no bearing on the fact that they walk through and are encroaching on suburban areas?

The only drivel is from YOU. How scarey that someone could be so ignorant.

I will only say this once... LADY, you have no idea at all about anything you are saying... I come from a conservation family and well, I'm sure they know the population of these animals and such..... I'm sure they wouldn't hand out that one extra doe tag during the year to be harvested in suburban area's either if there was not a problem in some states or counties..... I think our conservation has everything under control with the common people and our hunters who choose to be involved with conservation... and if it wasn't for the hunters buying licenses there would be no conservation wetlands, promotions, and saving somethings that are endangered that need to be saved "animal and land alike"

The population is growing cause we stupid humans keep building houses!!! I could create a Immunization for people to control that population but that would just be plain EVIL!! right??? "giggle"

So in other words why not take care of the problem so your poor little azalea shrubs don't get eaten ""help OH the deer are eating my shrubbss BOOHOOO!!!!!""" or some wild animal like a coyote runs down your toddler or your dog cause they are forced to live in-between houses......You must live in an apartment LOL!! Poor lil Bambi.....He taste real good too :eatpointe

Besides who cares about the butcher.. Deer are just as much fair game as some fattened calf kept in a pen not to move so some can have sweet little steaks on their plates..... wild game anyway is better for you and OHHHH SOOO YUMMMY!!!.. Cheaper too and no need to buy meet for MANY months... That is.... if your even lucky to harvest anything...Do you really think everytime we walk out in the woods we go home with something??? LOL every year I say MAN I hope I get one so I can fill the freezer.. No luck for the past two years

If you don't know what the heck your getting into or what your talking about maybe you should just .....go away......:devil01:

I really think this debate is dumb and can't believe where it's going to go to..



<~~~~~CHRISTINE

 

[ratsncorns]

It doesn't bother me when I hear about coyotes eating peoples pets. Its the humans fault for letting their animals outside unsupervised in the first place. They are domestic animals, afterall. Easy prey. Besides, as a bird biologist, I hate hearing about people leaving their cats outside. They are very damaging to wild bird populations, so I have no issues with coyotes killing them. Coyotes aren't the only animals killing them. Raccoons, raptors, and even possoms will take cats/small dogs. Or, if you're in Florida, big snakes!

FWIW, I don't think that coyotes are the problem.

 

[MedusaCorns]

So what happens to a deer when it is caught by a coyote?
well take a look.
This deer was found on my grandparents front lawn in the morning..whit a trail of coyote and deer tracks right behind leaving the woods..Blood and fur was all over their lawn..or on the snow..what a mess.
we put the carcass in the woods for the animals, with hopes that the coyote will come back for it and it will be shot!.:fullauto:
My grandparents cant risk their doges getting attacked..
and we felt bad for the deer.
Right now the deer are weak, and searching for food. The coyotes can stand on the melting snow still but the deer can not..resulting in many deer being ran down and killed..This was a real problem last year and too many deer died..it hurt the population pretty bad.
Lets hope this year is not as bad.

Sorry for the Images..Just wanted to share..(I thought it was pretty cool it didnt smell bad yet either..lol)

Anyway to get to this picture in my opinion... are you sure it's a coyote or maybe a dog that decided to have some fun? I do know that the snow does get deep and it's hard to for them to stand on the snow with their cloven hooves over the dog with it's snow shoe feet. I also know that during these times the coyote maybe eats to much and when the deer yard at night sometimes it's all in the joy of the kill.. Coyotes usually don't pack though.. More like family groups coming to breed to hang out till the pups are grown then they are off to be solitary.. Coydogs pack and it can be hard to tell a hybrid to a true coyote sometimes. Most of the time when something like that is found it was a thrill of the chase and kill.. to much looks to be left and not eaten.. Maybe it was hit too and a smaller carnivore like a fox had a share?????

 

[medusacoils]

It doesn't bother me when I hear about coyotes eating peoples pets. Its the humans fault for letting their animals outside unsupervised in the first place. They are domestic animals, afterall. Easy prey. Besides, as a bird biologist, I hate hearing about people leaving their cats outside. They are very damaging to wild bird populations, so I have no issues with coyotes killing them. Coyotes aren't the only animals killing them. Raccoons, raptors, and even possoms will take cats/small dogs. Or, if you're in Florida, big snakes!

FWIW, I don't think that coyotes are the problem.

This is something I can definitely agree with!! If I could, I would find a couple of predatory birds or mammals and toss them a stray cat! I hate cats! LOL!!

Wayne

 

[Hypancistrus]

The law may be different in MN, then in NH. In NH they actually have no bag limit or season.

The law is different everywhere, and well it should be. Animal populations are different everywhere.

This sentence makes me laugh, especially with whats in the headlines lately. Hunting is a solution to wildlife overpopulation? What is our solution to HUMAN overpopuation, cause that where this problem lies. If you do not have a better solution to invading their land and shooting them because you call it overpopulation, we shouldnt be building in their habitat, period.

Justine, what is your viable solution to human population and housing the humans that are here now? Do you have children? Do you plan on having children?

I find myself amazed and awed when I see wild creatures walking through urban areas and admire the adaptability of nature. Seeing a fox or coyote walk across a highway at 5am in the morning or seeing a tree grow in the middle of an abandoned house evokes a feeling which I can't accurately put into words. It's greater than awe and admiration.

As do I... but there is a point where you STOP being amazed... like when a white tailed deer runs out into the road and destroys the front end of your car, or worse yet, causes you to swerve and crash into another car, killing a child in said car....

If you are hungry there are plenty of carcasses wasting away in the meat section at Food Lion. Leave the deer in your yard alone. How much sense does it make to go out and kill something thats living, when the store already has animals that have been killed for you.

BTW, your last statement makes no sense. You have a thread where people are complaining Coyotes are eating things they are suppose to eat. MY argument should have been "Maybe we should feed our snakes spinach" Not yours.

The population you speak of, and animal collision accidents, you speak of, you dont seem to understand. I find it incredibly unlikely that our human population is growing rapidly, and so are the animals we feed off of? I dont think so. Especially with the climate change.

You CANNOT invade a widespread piece of land, build on it, bulldoze woods, and push animals that would have lived in a 60 mile wide town, and force them onto a piece of land the size of a football field and go "OH! See, they are overpopulated!" Their overpopulated on that because they should be living on something 80 times bigger and YOU took it away.

Justine, please do some research into valid wildlife management methods and population growth. You are clearly commenting on things you don't quite understand. I have a minor in wildlife as part of my fisheries degree, and I can tell you that even the PETA nutters we got in some of our classes knew better than to suggest half the things you have as examples of why not to hunt.....

And also, if you eat meat from the grocery store but do not condone hunting, then not only are you a hypocrite, but again, you also don't have a clear understanding of the positives and negatives of both methods of obtaining meat. If you're into "saving the planet", hunting is a heck of a lot more "environmentally friendly and sustainable."

Im saying the cycle of this planet is a very precious thing and every little thing has a place in that, some are more important then others. Who would have thought something like bees would be so detrimental to our planets existance?

If bees go extinct, they believe the planet will only be viable another 4 years.

See above. Also, the NYC in your name... are you actually from New York CITY? If so, that would explain quite a lot....

 

[MedusaCorns]

yeah I think if it was a coyote the belly would be gone... the more I'm looking at the picture.. Dogs that escape with a buddy often chase till the deer is run down and they constantly tare at the back end till the deer is dead.

 

[mynamesrick]

yeah I think if it was a coyote the belly would be gone... the more I'm looking at the picture.. Dogs that escape with a buddy often chase till the deer is run down and they constantly tare at the back end till the deer is dead.

i thought it looked kinda weird too.. whenever i see a deer that has been eaten by a coyote, there are parts all over the place. ill find random deer legs, and other bones by themselves in the woods when im looking for antlers. but maybe thats just minnesota coyotes..

 

[MedusaCorns]

yeah, wild carnivores usually go for the best parts first, starting with the belly "Yewwwww" lol

 

[jenneses]

This is something I can definitely agree with!! If I could, I would find a couple of predatory birds or mammals and toss them a stray cat! I hate cats! LOL!!

Wayne

I only hope your intending this to be an inflammatory remark because your testosterone is running and your looking for an argument... This would not be an advisable solution to the feral cat population. Also, what you deem a stray may be some child's pet.

As do I... but there is a point where you STOP being amazed... like when a white tailed deer runs out into the road and destroys the front end of your car, or worse yet, causes you to swerve and crash into another car, killing a child in said car....

I don't ever stop being amazed, but I'll agree with that there is a serious deer overpopulation and hunting is necessary for controlling the population. Prey species (deer and rabbit, primarily) are vastly overpopulated in my area, but due to hunting and the increase in wild predators (fox and coyote) we are able to control it so that native endangered flora has not been harmed to a devastating degree.

 

[Hypancistrus]

I don't ever stop being amazed, but I'll agree with that there is a serious deer overpopulation and hunting is necessary for controlling the population. Prey species (deer and rabbit, primarily) are vastly overpopulated in my area, but due to hunting and the increase in wild predators (fox and coyote) we are able to control it so that native endangered flora has not been harmed to a devastating degree.

So if you understand the issue with certain prey species such as deer and rabbit, then you understand that in certain areas, predatory species like coyote and fox can become the same way. They feed on the prey species, and with the boom in prey comes the boom in preds, a few years down the road... this causes the prey species numbers to fall, and when they do, this leaves hungry preds who may then turn to livestock and pets, causing conflict with humans.

It is great for people to claim they have no issue with a coyote taking a pet dog or cat, however, if it was YOUR dog or cat, one might feel differently. I for one would not want to find my dog savaged by a wild animal (even a python!)

I will grant that if I lived in the woods I would try and take steps to protect them with fencing and not letting them run free, but sometimes those steps aren't enough.

 

[medusacoils]

I only hope your intending this to be an inflammatory remark because your testosterone is running and your looking for an argument... This would not be an advisable solution to the feral cat population. Also, what you deem a stray may be some child's pet.

This is why I hate type!! LOL!! I can't quite seem to figure a way to mold my words into the, sarcastic category!! I am not serious! I never was. Can't you see the big, "LOL!!" at the end of the post? Cmon!

Stop being so literal!

Wayne

 

[danielle]

I had no clue this thread had got so nasty over hunting of all things? Meat at the grocery store is obtained from literal cow mills where they are pumped with antibiotics and hormones, kept in their own feces, and fed a diet thats is focused on bulking them up and not rearing a healthy animal. This is part of the reason wild game is healthier, far more lean, and sanitary compared to what we eat on a day to day basis. In all honestly before grocery stores and markets the only way our population survived and thrived was to hunt for their own food or starve. As wide scale farming, grocery stores, and markets were developed throughout our country animal populations began to climb to the point where these animals are beyond abundant and must be controled to some point. Yes these days there is less land for these animals driving them into our towns and yes I agree we are an overpopulated nation; but even if these animals had more land they would surely fill it. Its the law of the land literally in play. More animals, more reproduction, more animals, and more land needed by these animals the only solution is controled hunting. Each states rules vary but most have hunting seasons, limits on number killed, regulations against killing animals of a certain size, sex, and bans on the slaughter of pregnant females. I can not tell you how many times I have almost hit a deer and have totaled two cars when the butt heads jumped right in front of me one when I was 8 months pregnant. Deer and coyote alike are prolific breeders and are not in any way endangered animals. For many they are a source of food especially for the poor and are not killed to kill, but instead used in a variety of ways. Argueing whether or not hunting should be legal is just plain silly- some will hunt and others will not it really is that simple. Personally if I had coyotes roaming my property I would handle them immediately. They are quite aggressive and have gotten bold to the point where they are coming out during the day in search of food whether it be our dogs, cats, and yes even humans are attacked. The deer alone around here will come right in my yard day or night and eat whatever they please, but a coyote is a different story. Its all nice and fluffy to want to trap them and relocate them but 1. this isn't free 2. then their just another part of towns problem 3. it just isn't effective. Populations need to be controled one way or another and with fewer wolves and bears coyotes are able to mulyiply in numbers that endanger the places we call home, the safety of our children, and our pets. I say shoot away!

 

[Cornsnake124]

I really love coyotes..I think they are great..

Out here we hate the coyotes because they will attack the young calves. I am happy to see a deer go, though...

 

[jenneses]

So if you understand the issue with certain prey species such as deer and rabbit, then you understand that in certain areas, predatory species like coyote and fox can become the same way. They feed on the prey species, and with the boom in prey comes the boom in preds, a few years down the road... this causes the prey species numbers to fall, and when they do, this leaves hungry preds who may then turn to livestock and pets, causing conflict with humans.

It is great for people to claim they have no issue with a coyote taking a pet dog or cat, however, if it was YOUR dog or cat, one might feel differently. I for one would not want to find my dog savaged by a wild animal (even a python!)

I will grant that if I lived in the woods I would try and take steps to protect them with fencing and not letting them run free, but sometimes those steps aren't enough.

I agree 100%, which is why I never made a statement against hunting, but for hunting to manage populations. I don't know what my native predator population is here at this point to make an educated statement on that subject.

This is why I hate type!! LOL!! I can't quite seem to figure a way to mold my words into the, sarcastic category!! I am not serious! I never was. Can't you see the big, "LOL!!" at the end of the post? Cmon!

Stop being so literal!

Wayne

It is difficult to portray sarcasm in a post. In a written medium, it's hard not to be literal. I can only make determinations on what you post since I don't have tone or body language. Honestly, I thought the LOL was you enjoying the thought of killing a cat.

 

[Hypancistrus]

I agree 100%, which is why I never made a statement against hunting, but for hunting to manage populations.

So you support hunting as a tool to manage wildlife populations?

(Sorry it's late and I'm still ghost-spooked )